Can't shift

Pat wrote:
> "Jeff" <kidsdoc2000 RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote
>
> | I think it could also be a problem with the clutch cylinder or the other
> | parts of the clutch, although I agree that chances are a new clutch is
> | needed.
>
> If it does need a whole new clutch, how big a job is that?

I think you have to lift the whole engine, so it is a lot of labor. I
don't know for this van, but, in general, I think it costs around $500
to $700 for a replacement.

If it's in the cylinder or other linkage, it may be significantly less,
like $200.

Jeff
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"Jeff" <kidsdoc2000.TakeThisOut@hotmail.com> wrote
| Pat wrote:

| > If it does need a whole new clutch, how big a job is that?
|
| I think you have to lift the whole engine, so it is a lot of labor. I
| don't know for this van, but, in general, I think it costs around $500
| to $700 for a replacement.
|
| If it's in the cylinder or other linkage, it may be significantly less,
| like $200.

I'm hoping all it needs is fluid topped off. Could it be that simple??? It's
been a long, long while since I checked the fluid.....
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Pat" <just_a_ghost.RemoveThis@in_this_house.com> wrote in message
news:rPudnWJk0fsnZtPVnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@centurytel.net...
>I have an '87 Toyota minivan. It's a 5-speed and I've never had a problem
> with the transmission or clutch - until yesterday.
>
> When I backed out of the driveway, the clutch acted way different, I let
> it
> out at the usual speed but the car jumped backward and stalled. When I
> went
> to shift into 1st gear I couldn't do it, the knob just would not go there.
> I
> couldn't get it back into reverse either, there was a grinding sound. So I
> let the car roll back into the driveway and shut it off.
>
> I can still shift into any of the gears when the car is turned off. What
> could be wrong?
>

You got a lot of advice here, but I'll chime in.

The problem is not with the clutch engaging, the problem is that the clutch
is not disengaging.

I doubt if it is a broken clutch fork - those failure are very rare.

The clutch master cylinder is the most likely suspect so follow the advice
regarding checking fluid level and pumping the clutch pedal.

If the clutch itself needs replacement, it is an easier job than on a FWD
vehicle.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
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Pat wrote:
> "Jeff" <kidsdoc2000 RemoveThis @hotmail.com> wrote
> | Pat wrote:
>
> | > If it does need a whole new clutch, how big a job is that?
> |
> | I think you have to lift the whole engine, so it is a lot of labor. I
> | don't know for this van, but, in general, I think it costs around $500
> | to $700 for a replacement.
> |
> | If it's in the cylinder or other linkage, it may be significantly less,
> | like $200.
>
> I'm hoping all it needs is fluid topped off. Could it be that simple??? It's
> been a long, long while since I checked the fluid.....

Go and check the fluid now.

It could be that simple, but one would expect gradually worsening
symptoms, rather than a sudden failure.

Jeff
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Jeff" <kidsdoc2000.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote

| Go and check the fluid now.

I'll have to do it in the morning. I will report back then.

| It could be that simple, but one would expect gradually worsening
| symptoms, rather than a sudden failure.

Maybe it had symptoms and I failed to notice.... I've been very pre-occupied
lately. I thought the brakes seemed a bit soft, and if the clutch runs off
the same fluid, couldn't the softness of the brakes have been a symptom?

Thanks so much for all your help :}
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

Sounds like the clutch fork broke.

If you select a gear, THEN start the motor while the clutch pedal is
depressed, does the van stay in one place, or does it move with the starter
motor?



"Pat" <just_a_ghost RemoveThis @in_this_house.com> wrote in message
news:rPudnWJk0fsnZtPVnZ2dnUVZ_hudnZ2d@centurytel.net...
>I have an '87 Toyota minivan. It's a 5-speed and I've never had a problem
> with the transmission or clutch - until yesterday.
>
> When I backed out of the driveway, the clutch acted way different, I let
> it
> out at the usual speed but the car jumped backward and stalled. When I
> went
> to shift into 1st gear I couldn't do it, the knob just would not go there.
> I
> couldn't get it back into reverse either, there was a grinding sound. So I
> let the car roll back into the driveway and shut it off.
>
> I can still shift into any of the gears when the car is turned off. What
> could be wrong?
>
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr.TakeThisOut@verizon.net> wrote

| Sounds like the clutch fork broke.

Even though I don't have a clue what a clutch fork is, this sounds like a
reasonable idea.

| If you select a gear, THEN start the motor while the clutch pedal is
| depressed, does the van stay in one place, or does it move with the
starter
| motor?

It does not move until I let the clutch out. Not sure I understand the
question... You can't start this vehicle without the clutch being depressed.
The weird thing was when I started letting the clutch out to back up, it
moved faster than usual. It's like the clutch takes much less effort than
before.
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr.TakeThisOut@verizon.net> wrote

| Some people arfe adept at machines, and this problem would not prevent
them
| from driving to the repair shop. You do not sound to be one of these
people.

I'm not much use as a mechanic but I'm an excellent driver....

| Drive slowly and deliberately.... it takes practice and an
| at-oneness-with-your-machine that you do not sound
| as if you possess.

I really am an excellent driver. That's gotta count for something!
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

Pat wrote:
> "Jeff" <kidsdoc2000.RemoveThis@hotmail.com> wrote
>
> | Go and check the fluid now.
>
> I'll have to do it in the morning. I will report back then.
>
> | It could be that simple, but one would expect gradually worsening
> | symptoms, rather than a sudden failure.
>
> Maybe it had symptoms and I failed to notice.... I've been very pre-occupied
> lately. I thought the brakes seemed a bit soft, and if the clutch runs off
> the same fluid, couldn't the softness of the brakes have been a symptom?

Although both the brakes and clutch use hydraulic fluid (basically oil)
to push the clutch or brakes, the systems are isolated from each other.
So clutch problems won't affect the brakes and vice versa.

You should have your brakes checked, too. Perhaps you will need your
brake fluid changed too. I know you said you don't have a lot of money,
but, you can't take a second job if you're dead.

> Thanks so much for all your help :}
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Jeff" <kidsdoc2000 DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote

| Although both the brakes and clutch use hydraulic fluid (basically oil)
| to push the clutch or brakes, the systems are isolated from each other.
| So clutch problems won't affect the brakes and vice versa.
|
| You should have your brakes checked, too. Perhaps you will need your
| brake fluid changed too. I know you said you don't have a lot of money,
| but, you can't take a second job if you're dead.

I was reading this page:

http://www.autozone.com/shopping/repairGuide.htm?pageId=0900c1528008135f

It does not say there is a separate place to check transmission/clutch
fluid, so I assumed they are sharing the fluid. Is the info on that page
incomplete?
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"Pat" <just_a_ghost DeleteThis @in_this_house.com> wrote in message
news:ebCdnY5XEYltg9LVnZ2dnUVZ_hCdnZ2d@centurytel.net...
>
> "Jeff" <kidsdoc2000 DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote
>
> | Go and check the fluid now.
>
> I'll have to do it in the morning. I will report back then.
>
> | It could be that simple, but one would expect gradually worsening
> | symptoms, rather than a sudden failure.
>
> Maybe it had symptoms and I failed to notice.... I've been very
> pre-occupied
> lately. I thought the brakes seemed a bit soft, and if the clutch runs off
> the same fluid, couldn't the softness of the brakes have been a symptom?
>


The clutch and the brakes use the same fluid, but are not the same systems.
They are completely separated. Your kitchen sink and your toilets use the
same water, and drain to the same place, but they are separate systems.
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

"Jeff Strickland" <crwlr.DeleteThis@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:gIF3k.4779$8q2.3639@trnddc02...
>
> "Pat" <just_a_ghost.DeleteThis@in_this_house.com> wrote in message
> news:ebCdnY5XEYltg9LVnZ2dnUVZ_hCdnZ2d@centurytel.net...
>>
>> "Jeff" <kidsdoc2000.DeleteThis@hotmail.com> wrote
>>
>> | Go and check the fluid now.
>>
>> I'll have to do it in the morning. I will report back then.
>>
>> | It could be that simple, but one would expect gradually worsening
>> | symptoms, rather than a sudden failure.
>>
>> Maybe it had symptoms and I failed to notice.... I've been very
>> pre-occupied
>> lately. I thought the brakes seemed a bit soft, and if the clutch runs
>> off
>> the same fluid, couldn't the softness of the brakes have been a symptom?
>>
>
>
> The clutch and the brakes use the same fluid, but are not the same
> systems. They are completely separated. Your kitchen sink and your toilets
> use the same water, and drain to the same place, but they are separate
> systems.


You're pretty smart when you're not talking about subjects you know nothing
about, like government & politics.
 >> Stay informed about: Can't shift 

On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 19:23:01 -0500, Pat wrote:

> | The upside is, if I can find the thing, and if it fits, I'll sell it to
> | you for $40.
> |
> | Fill the master cylinder under..the..hood...ooops...I don't *know* where
> | the MC is on this thing! But check the MC, fill it, and then with the
> | engine off pump the clutch while someone else has a look under the van.
> | Chances are it's pissing out of somewhere, perhaps the fluid line
> | instead of the cylinder. Also, look at the top of the clutch pedal where
> | it mates to the plunger from the MC and see if the carpet is soaked. A
> | bad MC will do the same thing. I replaced both on the Celica.
>
> Thanks so much for your advice. If the slave will fit and is needed, and
> the shipping isn't too high, I'd sure buy it from you.

Shoot, I've had the thing for three years now.

Shipping will be about $2. To get rid of the thing is worth it.
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