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Why did I buy a used Subaru?

 
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JCF

External


Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 1) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:49 pm
Post subject: Why did I buy a used Subaru?
Archived from groups: alt>autos>subaru (more info?)

Someone please tell me.

In late July, I bought a used 99 Outback Wagon, manual transmission, higher
mileage, 120K. I didn't pay a lot for it, but having bought it from a
dealer who stated that the vehicle had been thoroughly checked, I assumed
that I had made a decent, at least moderately reliable, purchase.

Two days after purchase, I noticed the temp gauge climbing. No engine
light, but after driving it a bit, I opened the hood, and the coolant was
boiling. Dealer towed it, said the head gasket was blown and there was
piston damage. They towed and repaired at no charge. Good.

Four weeks later, the engine starts sputtering and the check engine light
comes on. Since the dealer is 40 miles away, I take it to my local
mechanic, who has serviced other cars for me over a 10 year period and in
whom I have a lot of trust. My mechanic says the engine light came from a
problem with the cam, that the crank had jumped three teeth and that it
looked like there could be engine damage, all effects which would have been
consistent with an inappropriately-performed gasket replacement. At this
point, the car is out of the 30-day, 1000 mile dealer service period (even
with the car being in the shop for a week with the gasket issue; also I have
1050 miles on total). But I call the dealer, they tow it and instead feel
that the problem was caused by a tensioning wheel. No evidence of engine
damage, they say. They offer to split the repair cost, which I think is
fair, and offer to drive it a bit.

Three days later, the repair is done. Then I get a call with, "Oh by the
way, the clutch is slipping and you're going to need to replace that."

Now, I don't expect a higher mileage used car to run like a new one. I
anticipate having repairs to a used car. Brakes will go, clutches, pumps
and all that. But I find it amazing that I have now had two significant
engine repairs, and the clutch is on the way out, within six weeks of
purchase. The dealer clearly stated that the car had been looked over
carefully before I purchased it, and, of course, touted the service
department. Am I unreasonable to think that some of these issues should
have been obvious if they did indeed look over the car carefully? Should
any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been disclosed
prior to purchase?

I am one unhappy Subaru owner who now walks to work every day. Thanks in
advance for your replies.... cars are not my specialty.

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Body Roll

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Since: Mar 17, 2006
Posts: 156



(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:49 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

JCF wrote:
>
> I am one unhappy Subaru owner who now walks to work every day. Thanks in
> advance for your replies.... cars are not my specialty.

I have learned the same lesson with my first Subaru:
Never EVER buy a used Subaru. Usually someone milked one for good
and dumped it onto someone else to pay for expensive repairs.

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Rick Courtright

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Since: Jan 12, 2004
Posts: 227



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:49 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

JCF wrote:

> Should any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been
> disclosed prior to purchase?

Hi,

Sorry your experience hasn't been good, but one must remember used cars
are a "buyer beware" item. Some states' laws may require disclosure of
"known" problems, but that's not universal practice.

Probably the most important question I ask when looking at a used car is
"Why did the previous owner want to replace it?"

With luck, these problems will soon be resolved and you'll become a
happier Subie owner.

Rick
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STiG

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Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 1



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 2:49 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Sorry to hear about your troubles. It should be said that any used car
in general, let it be BMW, Honda, Toyota, Subaru, Ferrari, you need to
be weary of it's condition, past maintenance history, etc.


Rick Courtright wrote:
> JCF wrote:
>
> > Should any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been
> > disclosed prior to purchase?
>
> Hi,
>
> Sorry your experience hasn't been good, but one must remember used cars
> are a "buyer beware" item. Some states' laws may require disclosure of
> "known" problems, but that's not universal practice.
>
> Probably the most important question I ask when looking at a used car is
> "Why did the previous owner want to replace it?"
>
> With luck, these problems will soon be resolved and you'll become a
> happier Subie owner.
>
> Rick
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JCF

External


Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 5) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:23 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Rick Courtright" <rcourtright.TakeThisOut@iname.com> wrote in message
news:4505C106.24C04A5@iname.com...
> JCF wrote:
>
>> Should any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been
>> disclosed prior to purchase?
>
> Hi,
>
> Sorry your experience hasn't been good, but one must remember used cars
> are a "buyer beware" item. Some states' laws may require disclosure of
> "known" problems, but that's not universal practice.
>
> Probably the most important question I ask when looking at a used car is
> "Why did the previous owner want to replace it?"
>
> With luck, these problems will soon be resolved and you'll become a
> happier Subie owner.
>
> Rick

Thanks for the response. I certainly hope it gets better, because the car
itself, when it works, is awesome. Stable, responsive, a pleasure to drive.

In my case, the car I bought was billed by the dealer as "a trade that the
previous Owner made to buy a new Outback. We usually don't sell high
mileage cars, but this one was exceptionally clean....all the maintenance
has been done." Buyer beware, I know. On one hand, I am thankful I bought
from a dealer because, in an effort to keep their reputation intact, they
performed some extensive repairs that they had not counted on; if I had
bought privately, I would be SOL. On the other hand, I question whether
they bought a piece of junk, couldn't figure that out or knew it and then
tried to pass it off onto the next buyer.

I'll have to look into the disclosure laws, and at the very least, will be
writing a terse letter to the dealer.
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Edward Hayes

External


Since: May 09, 2004
Posts: 312



(Msg. 6) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Be angry with the dealer and yourself but, not the car.
"JCF" <cf1992.RemoveThis@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:ee4b3002gb@news1.newsguy.com...
> Someone please tell me.
>
> In late July, I bought a used 99 Outback Wagon, manual transmission,
> higher mileage, 120K. I didn't pay a lot for it, but having bought
> it from a dealer who stated that the vehicle had been thoroughly
> checked, I assumed that I had made a decent, at least moderately
> reliable, purchase.
>
> Two days after purchase, I noticed the temp gauge climbing. No
> engine light, but after driving it a bit, I opened the hood, and the
> coolant was boiling. Dealer towed it, said the head gasket was
> blown and there was piston damage. They towed and repaired at no
> charge. Good.
>
> Four weeks later, the engine starts sputtering and the check engine
> light comes on. Since the dealer is 40 miles away, I take it to my
> local mechanic, who has serviced other cars for me over a 10 year
> period and in whom I have a lot of trust. My mechanic says the
> engine light came from a problem with the cam, that the crank had
> jumped three teeth and that it looked like there could be engine
> damage, all effects which would have been consistent with an
> inappropriately-performed gasket replacement. At this point, the
> car is out of the 30-day, 1000 mile dealer service period (even with
> the car being in the shop for a week with the gasket issue; also I
> have 1050 miles on total). But I call the dealer, they tow it and
> instead feel that the problem was caused by a tensioning wheel. No
> evidence of engine damage, they say. They offer to split the repair
> cost, which I think is fair, and offer to drive it a bit.
>
> Three days later, the repair is done. Then I get a call with, "Oh
> by the way, the clutch is slipping and you're going to need to
> replace that."
>
> Now, I don't expect a higher mileage used car to run like a new one.
> I anticipate having repairs to a used car. Brakes will go,
> clutches, pumps and all that. But I find it amazing that I have now
> had two significant engine repairs, and the clutch is on the way
> out, within six weeks of purchase. The dealer clearly stated that
> the car had been looked over carefully before I purchased it, and,
> of course, touted the service department. Am I unreasonable to
> think that some of these issues should have been obvious if they did
> indeed look over the car carefully? Should any of this, or could
> any of these potential issues have been disclosed prior to purchase?
>
> I am one unhappy Subaru owner who now walks to work every day.
> Thanks in advance for your replies.... cars are not my specialty.
>
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JCF

External


Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 7) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 4:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Edward Hayes" <erhayes.RemoveThis@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message
news:UEiNg.24192$QM6.13714@bgtnsc05-news.ops.worldnet.att.net...
> Be angry with the dealer and yourself but, not the car.

Umm, yeah, being upset with the dealer was kinda the point of the original
post.

> of course, touted the service department. Am I unreasonable to think that
> some of these issues should have been obvious if they did indeed look over
> the car carefully? Should any of this, or could any of these potential
> issues have been disclosed prior to purchase?
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Edward Hayes

External


Since: May 09, 2004
Posts: 312



(Msg. 8) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 7:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Next time you buy used you may want to consider a "certified" used
vehicle with a reasonable warranty like 4y/60K miles and a no or small
deductible.
"STiG" <dwong430 DeleteThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1158007270.488352.90700@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Sorry to hear about your troubles. It should be said that any used
> car
> in general, let it be BMW, Honda, Toyota, Subaru, Ferrari, you need
> to
> be weary of it's condition, past maintenance history, etc.
>
>
> Rick Courtright wrote:
>> JCF wrote:
>>
>> > Should any of this, or could any of these potential issues have
>> > been
>> > disclosed prior to purchase?
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Sorry your experience hasn't been good, but one must remember used
>> cars
>> are a "buyer beware" item. Some states' laws may require disclosure
>> of
>> "known" problems, but that's not universal practice.
>>
>> Probably the most important question I ask when looking at a used
>> car is
>> "Why did the previous owner want to replace it?"
>>
>> With luck, these problems will soon be resolved and you'll become a
>> happier Subie owner.
>>
>> Rick
>
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Carl 1 Lucky Texan

External


Since: Jan 20, 2004
Posts: 984



(Msg. 9) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 8:55 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

JCF wrote:
> "Rick Courtright" <rcourtright.RemoveThis@iname.com> wrote in message
> news:4505C106.24C04A5@iname.com...
>
>>JCF wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Should any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been
>>>disclosed prior to purchase?
>>
>>Hi,
>>
>>Sorry your experience hasn't been good, but one must remember used cars
>>are a "buyer beware" item. Some states' laws may require disclosure of
>>"known" problems, but that's not universal practice.
>>
>>Probably the most important question I ask when looking at a used car is
>>"Why did the previous owner want to replace it?"
>>
>>With luck, these problems will soon be resolved and you'll become a
>>happier Subie owner.
>>
>>Rick
>
>
> Thanks for the response. I certainly hope it gets better, because the car
> itself, when it works, is awesome. Stable, responsive, a pleasure to drive.
>
> In my case, the car I bought was billed by the dealer as "a trade that the
> previous Owner made to buy a new Outback. We usually don't sell high
> mileage cars, but this one was exceptionally clean....all the maintenance
> has been done." Buyer beware, I know. On one hand, I am thankful I bought
> from a dealer because, in an effort to keep their reputation intact, they
> performed some extensive repairs that they had not counted on; if I had
> bought privately, I would be SOL. On the other hand, I question whether
> they bought a piece of junk, couldn't figure that out or knew it and then
> tried to pass it off onto the next buyer.
>
> I'll have to look into the disclosure laws, and at the very least, will be
> writing a terse letter to the dealer.
>
>

Other than the HG, which Soobs of that model range are known to
occasinally have problems with, I don't think your experience is unique
either to the car or the dealership. I could argue that it would've been
nice to know if the TB was seviced on schedule and if the clutch was
original - but really, you could substitute the word toyota, or mazda or
Ford for subaru in your story and I bet it has happened a dozen times to
someone else. I think also, because folks tend to keep their Soobs
around longer, even dealerships are so hungry to be able to offer used
models they tend to keep cars that, if a similar condition used Ford
showed up, they would send it to the wholesaler. I must say though, it
seems your dealership was fair.
Ask questions here, look around at www.ultimatesubaru.net and
www.nasioc.com and learn about your car. It will likely be very
enjoyable now and hopefully, when you need a new O2 sensor or MAF or
rear wheel bearings, you won't be surprised and might be able to fix
some of them yourself.

Carl


--
to reply, change ( .not) to ( .net)
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Vanguard

External


Since: Jan 28, 2006
Posts: 19



(Msg. 10) Posted: Mon Sep 11, 2006 9:40 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Body Roll" <aglyport RemoveThis @gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1158004153.172677.107220@i3g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
> JCF wrote:
>>
>> I am one unhappy Subaru owner who now walks to work every day.
>> Thanks in
>> advance for your replies.... cars are not my specialty.
>
> I have learned the same lesson with my first Subaru:
> Never EVER buy a used Subaru. Usually someone milked one for good
> and dumped it onto someone else to pay for expensive repairs.
>


There is no difference between Subies and any other make. LOTS of
consumers simply dispose of their vehicles after 2 to 3 years.
Doesn't matter what is the mileage, low or high. Doesn't matter what
is the condition, good or bad. They've been taught or somehow
contrued that after a few years that they should get a brand new car
because the old one will start having problems soon, whether or not it
shows any problems at all when they decide to get rid of it. It's
their form of preventative maintenance provided they can afford to
lose all that depreciation in the car's value over the front-end
heavily weighted reduction period. Also, many can afford their whim
of getting a new car because they are simply bored with the old one,
like folks that buy different clothes on each shopping spree. That's
great for the rest of us that like those dupes to eat up the most
depreciation of the vehicle and do all the initial repairs and tweaks
for new cars.

Regardless of what the dealer says, even if they claim to have ASE
certified mechanics, I still take the prospective purchase to my own
auto shop which also employs ASE mechanics (and ALL of them at the
auto shop are also master mechanics). If I genuinely am interested in
a particular car, I take it in to pay the $100, or so, to have it
fully inspected. That doesn't guarantee that all hidden problems
become revealed just because the dealer's and auto shop's mechanics
all inspected it but it gives an assurance level for the condition of
the vehicle.
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bigjim

External


Since: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 130



(Msg. 11) Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 3:07 am
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

When you buy a used car you buy someone else's troubles. Buy new next
time. A new kia is better than USED MERCEDES

JCF wrote:
> Someone please tell me.
>
> In late July, I bought a used 99 Outback Wagon, manual transmission, higher
> mileage, 120K. I didn't pay a lot for it, but having bought it from a
> dealer who stated that the vehicle had been thoroughly checked, I assumed
> that I had made a decent, at least moderately reliable, purchase.
>
> Two days after purchase, I noticed the temp gauge climbing. No engine
> light, but after driving it a bit, I opened the hood, and the coolant was
> boiling. Dealer towed it, said the head gasket was blown and there was
> piston damage. They towed and repaired at no charge. Good.
>
> Four weeks later, the engine starts sputtering and the check engine light
> comes on. Since the dealer is 40 miles away, I take it to my local
> mechanic, who has serviced other cars for me over a 10 year period and in
> whom I have a lot of trust. My mechanic says the engine light came from a
> problem with the cam, that the crank had jumped three teeth and that it
> looked like there could be engine damage, all effects which would have been
> consistent with an inappropriately-performed gasket replacement. At this
> point, the car is out of the 30-day, 1000 mile dealer service period (even
> with the car being in the shop for a week with the gasket issue; also I have
> 1050 miles on total). But I call the dealer, they tow it and instead feel
> that the problem was caused by a tensioning wheel. No evidence of engine
> damage, they say. They offer to split the repair cost, which I think is
> fair, and offer to drive it a bit.
>
> Three days later, the repair is done. Then I get a call with, "Oh by the
> way, the clutch is slipping and you're going to need to replace that."
>
> Now, I don't expect a higher mileage used car to run like a new one. I
> anticipate having repairs to a used car. Brakes will go, clutches, pumps
> and all that. But I find it amazing that I have now had two significant
> engine repairs, and the clutch is on the way out, within six weeks of
> purchase. The dealer clearly stated that the car had been looked over
> carefully before I purchased it, and, of course, touted the service
> department. Am I unreasonable to think that some of these issues should
> have been obvious if they did indeed look over the car carefully? Should
> any of this, or could any of these potential issues have been disclosed
> prior to purchase?
>
> I am one unhappy Subaru owner who now walks to work every day. Thanks in
> advance for your replies.... cars are not my specialty.
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bigjim

External


Since: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 130



(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 12:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Why you should'nt buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Many suckers will pay like new prices for a used car. I have kept my
last two new cars for eight years and enjoyed years of payment free
driving. However when a huge repair hit is on the horizon I dump the
car and buy a new one. I would like to keep my 04 OBW for 200k miles
but if I see a yellow 4 door Wrangler the subie may have to go sooner.


Monique Y. Mudama wrote:
> On 2006-09-12, <stephandlulu.RemoveThis@gmail.com> penned:
> > Lets look at the Logic here (or lack of it)......
> > While there are exceptions to most any rule, Anytime a person trades
> > in/sells/dumps/walks away from a vehicle there is a serious problem.
> > You all know the buyer of a vehicle takes the hardest "hit/loss" in the
> > first few years of ownership.So WHY would someone want to sell a
> > 1/2/3 year old vehicle?WHY would they want to take a financial loss like
> > that?
>
> Because people buying new cars are not necessarily making a logical
> decision. Because people buying new cars may have more money than you,
> and therefore aren't as concerned with that dollar difference. Because
> people buying new cars are often buying them for the perceived features
> (bigger engine, better AWD, etc), not because there's anything
> objectively "wrong" with their old car. Because people have different
> priorities, and some people may put "shiny new car" at a higher priority
> than you do.
>
> In short, because there's a lot more to a purchase than pure logic, as
> car dealers and any other salespeople have known since roughly the
> dawn of time.
>
> --
> monique
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Monique Y. Mudama

External


Since: Feb 15, 2006
Posts: 24



(Msg. 13) Posted: Tue Sep 12, 2006 1:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Why you should'nt buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On 2006-09-12, <stephandlulu RemoveThis @gmail.com> penned:
> Lets look at the Logic here (or lack of it)......
> While there are exceptions to most any rule, Anytime a person trades
> in/sells/dumps/walks away from a vehicle there is a serious problem.
> You all know the buyer of a vehicle takes the hardest "hit/loss" in the
> first few years of ownership.So WHY would someone want to sell a
> 1/2/3 year old vehicle?WHY would they want to take a financial loss like
> that?

Because people buying new cars are not necessarily making a logical
decision. Because people buying new cars may have more money than you,
and therefore aren't as concerned with that dollar difference. Because
people buying new cars are often buying them for the perceived features
(bigger engine, better AWD, etc), not because there's anything
objectively "wrong" with their old car. Because people have different
priorities, and some people may put "shiny new car" at a higher priority
than you do.

In short, because there's a lot more to a purchase than pure logic, as
car dealers and any other salespeople have known since roughly the
dawn of time.

--
monique
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JCF

External


Since: Sep 11, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 14) Posted: Wed Sep 13, 2006 1:45 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"JCF" <cf1992.TakeThisOut@newsguy.com> wrote in message
news:ee4b3002gb@news1.newsguy.com...

Just to follow up on my original post, in case anyone is interested.

Late yesterday I spoke to my sales rep, who referred my call to the
dealership's general manager this morning. The dealership is concerned
about my dissatisfaction and has asked for an opportunity to look over the
car once more, have their service manager drive it, etc., and then work
either towards another repair or to "get me into a comparable vehicle."
There is a long way to go between here and there, but at this point, it is
the best I can hope for.

Again, it has been a bad experience, but I am so thankful that at least I am
working with a dealer, and that the dealer has been cooperative in
attempting to address my concerns.
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Paul Knudsen

External


Since: Oct 11, 2006
Posts: 4



(Msg. 15) Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2006 8:04 pm
Post subject: Re: Why did I buy a used Subaru? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

On Mon, 11 Sep 2006 14:49:03 -0400, "JCF" <cf1992.DeleteThis@newsguy.com> wrote:

>In late July, I bought a used 99 Outback Wagon, manual transmission, higher
>mileage, 120K.

I don't know what you expected buying a car with that many miles on
it.
--
Top 10 Conservative Idiots:
http://journals.democraticunderground.com/top10
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