Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble?

"Sean Elkins" <sean_elkins.DeleteThis@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:sean_elkins-40322F.19365010062008@iglou.read.readnews.com...
> Has anybody here used foam pipe insulation to wrap the cool line inside
> their engine compartment?
>
> I stumbled on the idea here:
> http://www.matrixowners.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t29160.html
>
> The A/C is the only thing on my Matrix that I don't just love, so I'm
> really giving this idea some thought. As long as the insulation doesn't
> get too hot and ignite or melt, what could it hurt? <--- that's a
> serious question: what could it hurt?

The link didn't work for me so I'm not sure what they are insulating. As
Retired VIP pointed out, insulating the low pressure line won't do anything,
and may actually impair the performance of the AC system since an
uninsulated line does give off some heat before going through the condenser.

With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the sight
glass on the receiver drier. It should look like water is flowing past the
sight glass. If you see foam, the system needs recharging.

The high pressure lines are probably already insulated, but if they are not,
use insulation that does not absorb or trap moisture, or the line can
corrode. Obviously, don't use insulation near where it can touch anything
hot or that moves.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

On Tue, 10 Jun 2008 19:36:56 -0400, Sean Elkins
<sean_elkins RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

>Has anybody here used foam pipe insulation to wrap the cool line inside
>their engine compartment?
>
>I stumbled on the idea here:
>http://www.matrixowners.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t29160.html
>
>The A/C is the only thing on my Matrix that I don't just love, so I'm
>really giving this idea some thought. As long as the insulation doesn't
>get too hot and ignite or melt, what could it hurt? <--- that's a
>serious question: what could it hurt?

Adding insulation to the low pressure line won't help the A/C work
better. That line carries refrigerant from the evaporator to the
compressor. It's already done all the work it will do in the system.

Jack
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

Ray O wrote:

> With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the sight
> glass on the receiver drier. It should look like water is flowing past the
> sight glass. If you see foam, the system needs recharging.

Does that apply to R-134a systems?
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

Ray O wrote:

> ...With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the sight
> glass on the receiver drier...

There are cars made today that have sight glasses on the receiver drier?

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

Insulating the fat line will help some since heat absorbed on the
return trip to the compressor puts an added heat load on the system.
Insulating the skinny line may also help if that line is cooler than
the environment under the hood. Not sure if it is, but liquid lines
running through hot attics are sometimes insulated for this reason.

What would help more is cleaing the condenser and evaporator coils.
The condenser coils are next to the radiator and can be gently
backflushed with a hose. The evaporator coils are under the dash and
are harder to access, but can also be cleaned if you can reach them.
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

"Bill Putney" <bptn DeleteThis @kinez.net> wrote in message
news:6b9nj4F3647jgU1@mid.individual.net...
> Ray O wrote:
>
>> ...With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the
>> sight glass on the receiver drier...
>
> There are cars made today that have sight glasses on the receiver drier?
>

Yup, most, if not all, Toyotas.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

<manny.RemoveThis@london.com> wrote in message
news:1d90b8ca-ca75-4259-b9ae-d37e4214ce34@c19g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
>
>
> Ray O wrote:
>
>> With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the
>> sight
>> glass on the receiver drier. It should look like water is flowing past
>> the
>> sight glass. If you see foam, the system needs recharging.
>
> Does that apply to R-134a systems?

Yes.
--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

"DIYBOI" <rbrailas.DeleteThis@courts.state.tx.us> wrote in message
news:57b645c6-89c1-4ef0-97a9-64819e688963@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Insulating the fat line will help some since heat absorbed on the
> return trip to the compressor puts an added heat load on the system.
> Insulating the skinny line may also help if that line is cooler than
> the environment under the hood. Not sure if it is, but liquid lines
> running through hot attics are sometimes insulated for this reason.

I think liquid lines running through hot attics are insulated so that
moisture does not condense on them and wet the attic insulation and corrode
the lines.

--

Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply)
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

Ray O wrote:
> <manny RemoveThis @london.com> wrote in message
> news:1d90b8ca-ca75-4259-b9ae-d37e4214ce34@c19g2000prf.googlegroups.com...

> With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the
> sight glass on the receiver drier. It should look like water is flowing past
> the sight glass. If you see foam, the system needs recharging.
> >
> > Does that apply to R-134a systems?
>
> Yes.

Does it also apply to R-12-to-R-134a conversions, where the R-134a
charge is 25% less than the recommended R-12 charge? I did what a
thought was a proper converson (new compressor, hoses, receiver-dryer,
and condenser, flushed evaporator), and the pressures and temps looked
right, but the sight glass was foamy at all RPMs and ambient temps.
The conversion still worked fine when I sold the car 5 years later.
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

Ray O wrote:
> "Bill Putney" <bptn DeleteThis @kinez.net> wrote in message
> news:6b9nj4F3647jgU1@mid.individual.net...
>> Ray O wrote:
>>
>>> ...With the engine running, and the AC on, open the hood and look at the
>>> sight glass on the receiver drier...
>> There are cars made today that have sight glasses on the receiver drier?
>>
>
> Yup, most, if not all, Toyotas.

Huh! I did not know that. Maybe MBA's aren't running the company.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

In article <sean_elkins-40322F.19365010062008.RemoveThis@iglou.read.readnews.com>,
Sean Elkins <sean_elkins.RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Has anybody here used foam pipe insulation to wrap the cool line inside
> their engine compartment?

A few years ago, Ford Motor Company thought it would be a good idea to
wrap the AC accumulator on Explorers with foam insulation.
Not good... The trapped moisture caused the accumulators to rust out.
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

On Jun 12, 9:06 am, aarcuda69062 <nonel....RemoveThis@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> In article <sean_elkins-40322F.19365010062....RemoveThis@iglou.read.readnews.com>,
>  Sean Elkins <sean_elk....RemoveThis@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > Has anybody here used foam pipe insulation to wrap the cool line inside
> > their engine compartment?
>
> A few years ago, Ford Motor Company thought it would be a good idea to
> wrap the AC accumulator on Explorers with foam insulation.
> Not good...  The trapped moisture caused the accumulators to rust out.

Have you seen any problems caused by the GM foam rubber sleeve they
fit around most of their accumulators? I have not. Perhaps the Ford
design created a complete seal of the unit, while the GM style is
slightly open at the top and has a hole in the bottom to shed
condensation.

Toyota MDT in MO
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble? 

In article
<e4a4e6dc-cd75-48a1-b3ea-812c2d771bc4 RemoveThis @x41g2000hsb.googlegroups.com>,
Comboverfish <comboverfish RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Jun 12, 9:06 am, aarcuda69062 <nonel... RemoveThis @sbcglobal.net> wrote:
> > In article <sean_elkins-40322F.19365010062... RemoveThis @iglou.read.readnews.com>,
> >  Sean Elkins <sean_elk... RemoveThis @yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Has anybody here used foam pipe insulation to wrap the cool line inside
> > > their engine compartment?
> >
> > A few years ago, Ford Motor Company thought it would be a good idea to
> > wrap the AC accumulator on Explorers with foam insulation.
> > Not good...  The trapped moisture caused the accumulators to rust out.
>
> Have you seen any problems caused by the GM foam rubber sleeve they
> fit around most of their accumulators? I have not. Perhaps the Ford
> design created a complete seal of the unit, while the GM style is
> slightly open at the top and has a hole in the bottom to shed
> condensation.
>
> Toyota MDT in MO

GM typically uses aluminum accumulators, the Ford ones were steel.

I still caution because the connecting parts may be steel and they're a
bear enough in some climates.

Where ya been hiding?

Got a bit of your weather up here... floods, lakes draining empty,
death and destruction. More rain this afternoon.
 >> Stay informed about: Low-cost A/C efficiency boost or asking for trouble?