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External
Since: Apr 11, 2005
Posts: 521
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:04 am
Post subject: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!)
Archived from groups: alt>autos>toyota, others (more info?)
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The headgasket 'repair' on my '89 Suby GL Coupe seems to be OK. I haven't
had a good look (since it won't stop SNOWING!) but the next day we get
where there's more than 5 minutes of sunshine I have to change the oil, so
I'll take a good look at the area where the coolant was weeping from the
headgasket. Other than that, the car seems to be running nicely.
After doing the 'repair' I noticed a new noise from the car, and a guy
from AutoZone surmized the gasket repai may have gotten into the water
pump bearing and is causing a problem. It was a bearing, alright, but it
was the A/C Idler pully bearing that seized! Of course, in the middle of
the night in East Overshoe. I put up with the smell until the belt wore
down enough to stop cooking, then cut it off the next day. (It's the A/C
belt, and is redundant to the fan and PS pump, but doesn't affect the
alternator.)
So, the question is HOW MUCH DRAG CAN AN IDLER PUT ON AN ENGINE?!?!?!?!
Holy Cow! After I cut the belt off, it was like driving a different car.
The acceleration is back, the car runs great, and the gas mileage went up,
even though I used AWD most of the night last night. Previously I was
getting 26 MPG on a warmer day, no AWD, and 19-21 MPG in the cold with the
AWD on. Last night I got 25 MPG using the AWD almost all night. |
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External
Since: Jun 02, 2006
Posts: 4627
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:04 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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<johngdole DeleteThis @hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:620def2d-5d1e-41d6-8fc8-1f3250f566f1@d21g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
> Otherwise I don't know why the belt would burn unless the compressor
> is generating a lot of resistance to turning.
The AC idler pulley was seized, not the AC clutch.
--
Ray O
(correct punctuation to reply) |
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External
Since: Jul 26, 2005
Posts: 1024
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:04 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>autos>toyota, others (more info?)
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If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
Otherwise I don't know why the belt would burn unless the compressor
is generating a lot of resistance to turning.
On Feb 8, 7:04 pm, Hachiroku <Tru... RemoveThis @ae86.gts> wrote:
> The headgasket 'repair' on my '89 Suby GL Coupe seems to be OK. I haven't
> had a good look (since it won't stop SNOWING!) but the next day we get
> where there's more than 5 minutes of sunshine I have to change the oil, so
> I'll take a good look at the area where the coolant was weeping from the
> headgasket. Other than that, the car seems to be running nicely.
>
> After doing the 'repair' I noticed a new noise from the car, and a guy
> from AutoZone surmized the gasket repai may have gotten into the water
> pump bearing and is causing a problem. It was a bearing, alright, but it
> was the A/C Idler pully bearing that seized! Of course, in the middle of
> the night in East Overshoe. I put up with the smell until the belt wore
> down enough to stop cooking, then cut it off the next day. (It's the A/C
> belt, and is redundant to the fan and PS pump, but doesn't affect the
> alternator.)
>
> So, the question is HOW MUCH DRAG CAN AN IDLER PUT ON AN ENGINE?!?!?!?!
> Holy Cow! After I cut the belt off, it was like driving a different car.
> The acceleration is back, the car runs great, and the gas mileage went up,
> even though I used AWD most of the night last night. Previously I was
> getting 26 MPG on a warmer day, no AWD, and 19-21 MPG in the cold with the
> AWD on. Last night I got 25 MPG using the AWD almost all night. >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: May 21, 2007
Posts: 1219
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:36 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: alt>autos>toyota, others (more info?)
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Hachiroku wrote:
> The headgasket 'repair' on my '89 Suby GL Coupe seems to be OK. I haven't
> had a good look (since it won't stop SNOWING!) but the next day we get
> where there's more than 5 minutes of sunshine I have to change the oil, so
> I'll take a good look at the area where the coolant was weeping from the
> headgasket. Other than that, the car seems to be running nicely.
>
> After doing the 'repair' I noticed a new noise from the car, and a guy
> from AutoZone surmized the gasket repai may have gotten into the water
> pump bearing and is causing a problem. It was a bearing, alright, but it
> was the A/C Idler pully bearing that seized! Of course, in the middle of
> the night in East Overshoe. I put up with the smell until the belt wore
> down enough to stop cooking, then cut it off the next day. (It's the A/C
> belt, and is redundant to the fan and PS pump, but doesn't affect the
> alternator.)
>
> So, the question is HOW MUCH DRAG CAN AN IDLER PUT ON AN ENGINE?!?!?!?!
> Holy Cow! After I cut the belt off, it was like driving a different car.
> The acceleration is back, the car runs great, and the gas mileage went up,
> even though I used AWD most of the night last night. Previously I was
> getting 26 MPG on a warmer day, no AWD, and 19-21 MPG in the cold with the
> AWD on. Last night I got 25 MPG using the AWD almost all night.
Obviously, a lot. If a brake were slowing decreasing the gas mileage
that much, it would be glowing red hot by the time you drove a few
miles. How long did you have a power loss? But I wonder if somehow the
problem caused the sensors to be messed up or something and that caused
the loss of power and poor mileage.
The other thing this type of seizure can cause is the crankshaft to be
pulled out of place (like pulled being pulled up to one side) because of
the extra torque needed. This could damage the bearings. I somehow
remember this ruining a few engines in the old days.
Jeff >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: May 21, 2007
Posts: 1219
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 4:20 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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johngdole.DeleteThis@hotmail.com wrote:
> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
> Otherwise I don't know why the belt would burn unless the compressor
> is generating a lot of resistance to turning.
When it is warmer out (say around 10 C or 50 F), the compressor often
comes on when the vent is set to the defog position to help dry the
windshield. This also helps keep the seals moist.
I have never heard of a problem with A/C with getting the refrigerant
slugged.
Jeff
>
> On Feb 8, 7:04 pm, Hachiroku <Tru....DeleteThis@ae86.gts> wrote:
>> The headgasket 'repair' on my '89 Suby GL Coupe seems to be OK. I haven't
>> had a good look (since it won't stop SNOWING!) but the next day we get
>> where there's more than 5 minutes of sunshine I have to change the oil, so
>> I'll take a good look at the area where the coolant was weeping from the
>> headgasket. Other than that, the car seems to be running nicely.
>>
>> After doing the 'repair' I noticed a new noise from the car, and a guy
>> from AutoZone surmized the gasket repai may have gotten into the water
>> pump bearing and is causing a problem. It was a bearing, alright, but it
>> was the A/C Idler pully bearing that seized! Of course, in the middle of
>> the night in East Overshoe. I put up with the smell until the belt wore
>> down enough to stop cooking, then cut it off the next day. (It's the A/C
>> belt, and is redundant to the fan and PS pump, but doesn't affect the
>> alternator.)
>>
>> So, the question is HOW MUCH DRAG CAN AN IDLER PUT ON AN ENGINE?!?!?!?!
>> Holy Cow! After I cut the belt off, it was like driving a different car.
>> The acceleration is back, the car runs great, and the gas mileage went up,
>> even though I used AWD most of the night last night. Previously I was
>> getting 26 MPG on a warmer day, no AWD, and 19-21 MPG in the cold with the
>> AWD on. Last night I got 25 MPG using the AWD almost all night.
> >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Aug 05, 2006
Posts: 76
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:30 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Fri, 08 Feb 2008 19:46:44 -0800, johngdole wrote:
> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
> Otherwise I don't know why the belt would burn unless the compressor
> is generating a lot of resistance to turning.
The AC clutch was one of the first things I checked on the car. It seems
to be operating normally: locking when the AC is turned on and
free-wheeling when off. It was the idler bearing that seized and started
burning the belt.
>
>
> On Feb 8, 7:04 pm, Hachiroku <Tru....DeleteThis@ae86.gts> wrote:
>> The headgasket 'repair' on my '89 Suby GL Coupe seems to be OK. I
>> haven't had a good look (since it won't stop SNOWING!) but the next day
>> we get where there's more than 5 minutes of sunshine I have to change
>> the oil, so I'll take a good look at the area where the coolant was
>> weeping from the headgasket. Other than that, the car seems to be
>> running nicely.
>>
>> After doing the 'repair' I noticed a new noise from the car, and a guy
>> from AutoZone surmized the gasket repai may have gotten into the water
>> pump bearing and is causing a problem. It was a bearing, alright, but
>> it was the A/C Idler pully bearing that seized! Of course, in the
>> middle of the night in East Overshoe. I put up with the smell until the
>> belt wore down enough to stop cooking, then cut it off the next day.
>> (It's the A/C belt, and is redundant to the fan and PS pump, but
>> doesn't affect the alternator.)
>>
>> So, the question is HOW MUCH DRAG CAN AN IDLER PUT ON AN ENGINE?!?!?!?!
>> Holy Cow! After I cut the belt off, it was like driving a different
>> car. The acceleration is back, the car runs great, and the gas mileage
>> went up, even though I used AWD most of the night last night.
>> Previously I was getting 26 MPG on a warmer day, no AWD, and 19-21 MPG
>> in the cold with the AWD on. Last night I got 25 MPG using the AWD
>> almost all night. >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Jan 21, 2008
Posts: 113
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:30 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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> johngdole wrote:
>
>> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
>> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
>> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
>>
The AC runs often in the winter - every time one uses one's Defrost setting.
It uses the AC to dry out the air.
Tomes >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Feb 09, 2008
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:30 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Tomes wrote:
>
> > johngdole wrote:
> >
> >> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
> >> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
> >> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
> >>
>
> The AC runs often in the winter - every time one uses one's Defrost setting.
> It uses the AC to dry out the air.
Also assuming things are working correctly (always a risky assumption) The
AC shouldn't have to do much work when the air is already cold and dry.
That is, the load on the engine is significantly less than when the
weather is hot and damp.
-jim
> Tomes >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Aug 05, 2006
Posts: 76
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 11:32 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Sat, 09 Feb 2008 03:36:08 +0000, Jeff wrote:
> The other thing this type of seizure can cause is the crankshaft to be
> pulled out of place (like pulled being pulled up to one side) because of
> the extra torque needed. This could damage the bearings. I somehow
> remember this ruining a few engines in the old days.
That's not good!
Luckily, not only was the bearing on the way out, but the tensioner also
was stuck at less-than full tension, so the belt was slightly slipping
anyway. >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Nov 20, 2006
Posts: 2548
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 8:02 pm
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Sat, 09 Feb 2008 08:53:05 -0500, Tomes wrote:
>> johngdole wrote:
>>
>>> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
>>> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
>>> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
>>>
>>>
> The AC runs often in the winter - every time one uses one's Defrost
> setting. It uses the AC to dry out the air.
> Tomes
This car is older than that... >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 13
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 9:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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External
Since: Nov 20, 2006
Posts: 2548
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 4:41 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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On Sat, 09 Feb 2008 21:48:15 +0000, Roger Blake wrote:
> In article <pFnrj.686$R64.301@trndny03>,
> =?iso-2022-jp?q?Hachiroku_=1B$B%O%A%m%=2F=1B=28B?= wrote:
>> This car is older than that...
>
> The earliest factory air conditioning systems (circa 1940 Packard) did not
> have a compressor clutch, the compressor ran whenever the engine was
> running. (To "turn off" the AC during the winter one would have to remove
> the compressor drive belt.)
The car is not *THAT* old...  >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Jan 21, 2008
Posts: 113
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 11:04 am
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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"Hachiroku ...
> Tomes wrote:
>>> johngdole wrote:
>>>
>>>> If the AC clutch seized then you'd be running AC during winter, right?
>>>> That probably won't be very good for the compressor if the refrigerant
>>>> couldn't evaporate. Your compressor is going to get liquid slugged.
>>>>
>>>>
>> The AC runs often in the winter - every time one uses one's Defrost
>> setting. It uses the AC to dry out the air.
>> Tomes
>
> This car is older than that...
>
Older than what? My little brain here is trying to tell me that the old
1971 Pontiac Safari wagon we had did this. When did using AC for defrost
start then?
Tomes >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Jan 20, 2004
Posts: 985
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Roger Blake wrote:
> In article <pFnrj.686$R64.301@trndny03>, =?iso-2022-jp?q?Hachiroku_=1B$B%O%A%m%=2F=1B=28B?= wrote:
>
>>This car is older than that...
>
>
> The earliest factory air conditioning systems (circa 1940 Packard)
> did not have a compressor clutch, the compressor ran whenever the
> engine was running. (To "turn off" the AC during the winter one would
> have to remove the compressor drive belt.)
>
I had a Rambler that had a 'Desert Only' switch. As near as I could
tell, the idea was to use the A/C to cool the heater core to assist in
engine cooling!
weird
Carl
--
to reply, change ( .not) to ( .net) >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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External
Since: Nov 28, 2004
Posts: 103
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Sun Feb 10, 2008 3:31 pm
Post subject: Re: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question...? (Ray O et al, listen up!) [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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>I had a Rambler that had a 'Desert Only' switch. As near as I could
>tell, the idea was to use the A/C to cool the heater core to assist in
>engine cooling!
I don't know what the desert mode did, but that wasn't it. Any heat
removed from the heater core by the a/c would be dumped by the
condenser plus the additional load on the engine from running the
compressor.
Steve B. >> Stay informed about: Follow up to Head Gasket in a bottle repair and a question.. |
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