Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends?

No--is this something a hack could do?

(Also, a steel beam fell on the front end of my car (with enough force
to puncture the radiator) but the guy who did the repairs on that said
it wouldn't have effected the tie rod ends {?}}
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

"Jon" wrote in message

> Hello:
>
> I've got a '99 Camry and have been told it needs new tie rod ends (guys
> at alignment place said they couldn't align car until they were
> replaced). Car has got 135 k miles on it and I don't notice anything
> terribly sloppy with the handling at this point.
>
> Just wondering if someone could give me a sense of what the drawbacks
> would be of trying to let this problem go--I hope to get 200k out of
> the car, at least.
>
Sounds odd - mine is a 91 with 200,000km and I think they're still OK. Did
you have a look yourself?
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

>> I've got a '99 Camry and have been told it needs new tie rod ends (guys
>> at alignment place said they couldn't align car until they were
>> replaced). Car has got 135 k miles on it and I don't notice anything
>> terribly sloppy with the handling at this point.
>>
>> Just wondering if someone could give me a sense of what the drawbacks
>> would be of trying to let this problem go--I hope to get 200k out of
>> the car, at least.
>
> Worn tires, instability, loss of control, death

But he asked for the drawbacks...
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

Get a second opinion.
The best thing would be to check for yourself.
Raise the front wheels off the ground, grasp the tire firmly at the
9:00 and 3:00 o'clock positions and move forcefully checking for any
looseness.
The tie rods ends are small rotating joints that simply "tie" the ends
of the steering linkage coming off the steering rack to the steering
knuckle that holds the wheel bearing, strut and ball joint.
The tie rod ends are permanently lubricated. If the rubber seals are
not damaged or leaking grease, generally the tie rod ends should be OK
- but you can check as above.
Another indication of worn tie rod ends would be excessive play in the
steering wheel - but this can develop gradually over time and you may
have just adjusted to it.
If a tie rod end ever let go, you would suffer immediate loss of
steering control on that wheel - so you need to confirm whether you
actually have a problem.
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

Thanks--just what I was looking for.

Jon
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

As noted in the article that I posted a link to, nowadays an average
joe can't safely be sure there is nothing wrong with the system....

Sure, if you go ahead and "check" it yourself and it turns out bad.
Great. You've confirmed it. But as noted in the prior link, what if
your shadetree check undercovers no problems, so you go off happy and
next thing you know you lose it at 55 mph.

I wouldn't want that in the back of my mind.
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

Car's got 135K miles on it - and he hasn't noticed anything unusual,
and he has been advised to get a second opinion.

I suspect the alignment guy trying to sell extra parts before I suspect
the tie rod ends.

Lots of Camrys go well over 250k with original tie rod ends.

Here's my story on a full size Cadillac I used to own. A tire shop told
me the ball joints should be replaced, so I agreed. (I have no idea
whether they were actually faulty)

Months later I was coming out of a shopping center driveway at very low
speed when the whole right front corner of the car came crashing to the
ground. The mechanic had forgotten to install the cotter pin for the
ball joint when he replaced it, and I later learned he had a drug
problem.

One of the reasons I trust my own work more is that I could give you a
long list of experiences where something was lacking following repair
work - usually not this serious thankfully.

I did have the tie rod ends replaced on the 1977 Toyota truck several
years ago and those were truly worn - so it gives you an idea how long
they can be expected to last. The original poster's Camry is a 1999.
The '77 required periodic lubrication service through a grease fitting,
unlike the sealed '99 tie rod end.

If you want to go replacing front end parts - check the sway bar end
link grease seals. In my experience they're more likely to need
attention.
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

I agree with you in principle. However, the very fact that he asked
this question shows that his experience is limited. Nothing wrong with
that. Nobody knows everything, except my wife :>0

Odds are everything is fine. I once had the same sort of experience at
a Firestone dealer, and, as you said, they had basis to make there
prognosis.

But, fact of the matter is, there could be some type of non-obvious
problem that only experience would catch and some things, like steering
and brakes you really don't want to be part of the gambling crowd.

That's why it's important to find a good mechanic or two and stick with
them. But even then, they have off-days....like the day my mechanic
Ken put the air cleaner cover back on, but forgot the threaded stud as
well as the snap-clamps.....Luckily I only got about 200 yards down the
road before I noticed the rattle...
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

People say that - "steering and brakes are important - you need to
trust an experienced mechanic" - I agree steering and brakes are
important, but I still trust myself a lot more than I trust a mechanic.
Maybe I qualify as being a mechanic by now, having worked on cars since
1966, not as a professional mechanic, just an interest.
Actually I never like to drive at very high speed or under high stress
conditions until I've "been through" the car mechanically, because I
always finds things that weren't done quite right by prior mechanics.
With the brakes in my case it was failure to properly lubricate the
slide pins and clean their bores in the torque plate.
=======================
I remember being at a new car dealer when I was in college. I'd just
bought a used car, and read the owner's manual about how superior the
dealer service department was, so I'd brought the car in to have the
transaxle fluid changed.
While in the waiting area, I overheard a story about someone who had "a
funny noise" so the service department replaced the entire engine, and
afterward, the funny noise was still there. So I ignored the warning
signs about no admittance and went back to check on my car - still on
the lift. There were two (2) drain plugs and the mechanic had removed
only one (1). So I told him to remove the second drain plug. He said,
"Oh, that's not necessary." I said "If it's not necessary, why are
there two drain plugs?" He said, "Well I've already refilled it. If I
open the second drain plug, you'll have to pay for the extra fluid." I
said, "Fine." He opened the second drain plug and another half pint of
old, used dark gear oil drained out.
========================
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

"Jon" wrote in message

> No--is this something a hack could do?
>
> (Also, a steel beam fell on the front end of my car (with enough force
> to puncture the radiator) but the guy who did the repairs on that said
> it wouldn't have effected the tie rod ends {?}}
>
Probably not. Just see if you can forcefully wobble each front wheel side to
side without the steering wheel or the other wheel turning, or see if you
can feel or see play in the rod end itself - they are the rods with ball
joints which link the steering rack to each front axle assembly. Never seen
one wear so much it came apart, they usually get attention because of worn
tyres or loose steering. If they really are worn, it's possible the lower
and/or upper ball joints are worn too or even instead - they would be more
likely to possibly suffer damage from the beam. See if each wheel has
movement in the top to bottom plane when raised off the ground.
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

"Daniel" wrote in message

> People say that - "steering and brakes are important - you need to
> trust an experienced mechanic" - I agree steering and brakes are
> important, but I still trust myself a lot more than I trust a mechanic.
> Maybe I qualify as being a mechanic by now, having worked on cars since
> 1966, not as a professional mechanic, just an interest.
> Actually I never like to drive at very high speed or under high stress
> conditions until I've "been through" the car mechanically, because I
> always finds things that weren't done quite right by prior mechanics.
> With the brakes in my case it was failure to properly lubricate the
> slide pins and clean their bores in the torque plate.
> =======================
> I remember being at a new car dealer when I was in college. I'd just
> bought a used car, and read the owner's manual about how superior the
> dealer service department was, so I'd brought the car in to have the
> transaxle fluid changed.
> While in the waiting area, I overheard a story about someone who had "a
> funny noise" so the service department replaced the entire engine, and
> afterward, the funny noise was still there. So I ignored the warning
> signs about no admittance and went back to check on my car - still on
> the lift. There were two (2) drain plugs and the mechanic had removed
> only one (1). So I told him to remove the second drain plug. He said,
> "Oh, that's not necessary." I said "If it's not necessary, why are
> there two drain plugs?" He said, "Well I've already refilled it. If I
> open the second drain plug, you'll have to pay for the extra fluid." I
> said, "Fine." He opened the second drain plug and another half pint of
> old, used dark gear oil drained out.
> ========================

I share your disdain about most dealerships. A newbie would EXPECT
expert service, and he will darn sure pay premium prices. In my
experience,
most dealerships are incompetent.
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

timbirr.DeleteThis@mailcity.com wrote:
> As noted in the article that I posted a link to, nowadays an average
> joe can't safely be sure there is nothing wrong with the system....
>
> Sure, if you go ahead and "check" it yourself and it turns out bad.
> Great. You've confirmed it. But as noted in the prior link, what if
> your shadetree check undercovers no problems, so you go off happy and
> next thing you know you lose it at 55 mph.
>
> I wouldn't want that in the back of my mind.


Funny... I've got a similar issue with my '99 Camry (68k miles).

Took it to Pep Boys for a free brake inspection. They said my left
front tie rod was loose. (Of course they wanted me to schedule the
work for later. I said thank you, good bye.)

Finally had time this weekend to wash the car, and also removed the LF
wheel. Tie rod seemed firmly intact. (I didn't wobble the front wheel
while supported by the jack, though - have to try that when I find some
spare time.)

Just for a reference, I removed the right front wheel and inspected
that too... seemed secure.

There's only one tie rod in the front, right? Or are there two...?

I'll take it to Firestone for an alignment, once I find a coupon in the
mail. Pep Boys refused to do the alignment, saying the tie rod needed
attention first (but of course they didn't have the parts on-hand...)


I like my local Firestone, since they didn't try to force-sell me
services I didn't need - they said my '96 passed the alignment test,
and didn't need an alignment. Plus, they said my rear brakes didn't
need replacing - still looked new. Wow, honesty...
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends? 

>>>>I like my local Firestone, since they didn't try to force-sell me
services I didn't need - they said my '96 passed the alignment test,
and didn't need an alignment. Plus, they said my rear brakes didn't
need replacing - still looked new. Wow, honesty... >>>>
>>>>

Well, it could be honesty....and most likely is...but speaking of
experiences. A few years ago, I took my rig into a local Les Schwab
tire store....they are chain outfit that has earned something of a
legend for great service in the Pacific Northwest.

I needed two tires and I also KNEW I needed new struts and new front
brakes -- the struts were leaking and the brakes were almost down to
the metal. I told them to do the tires and then check the struts and
brakes and schedule me for replacement.

Came back a few hours later, well, lo-and-behold, the report was that I
DIDN'T need struts or brakes. Of course, they couldn't find the
"technician" who made that genius report.

I went down the road and had my regular mechanic do the work for me....
 >> Stay informed about: Downside to not replacing worn tie rod ends?