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Since: May 03, 2007 Posts: 828
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 9:56 am
Post subject: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ Archived from groups: alt>autos>gm (more info?)
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Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster
By Paul Ingrassia
Random House $26, 320 pages
Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
economical and reliable.
Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit revival.
This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
(ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
crushed by this vast systemic failure.
In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and exploded.
There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
race.
One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
professionally managed US corporation.
Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability were
of secondary importance.
Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare liabilities.
Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable cars
being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day – were
alien to American tastes.
Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a matter
of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the Big
Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce decent
cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks. Eventually
this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at confronting
GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to make the best of
them.
Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last year’s
disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s chief
executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to plead
for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic questions.
Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired by
Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives had
come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being run
by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne, the
head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace guy
and one Italian.
A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows convincingly
how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when it seemed to
be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it aside
in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
good things, however, come to an end.
--
Civis Romanus Sum >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 23, 2010 Posts: 2
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:50 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Jim Higgins wrote:
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> Disaster
> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> Disaster By Paul Ingrassia
> Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> economical and reliable.
>
> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement.
> As the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble
> over decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement,
> they would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car
> or
> initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
> revival.
> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
> mid-1990s) to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the
> biggest
> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
> exploded.
> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
> into the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a
> Lockheed
> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
> arms race.
>
> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder
> if GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> professionally managed US corporation.
>
> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
> Cadillac and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in
> the US postwar market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and
> design – the latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the
> boring,
> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
> Ford and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
> their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
> Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
> came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability
> were of secondary importance.
>
> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
> Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
> hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
> companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>
> A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
> Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
> labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
> liabilities.
> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
> but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
> Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable
> cars being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day –
> were alien to American tastes.
>
> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
> kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
> that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a
> matter of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>
> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the
> Big Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce
> decent cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks.
> Eventually this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>
> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
> and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at
> confronting GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to
> make the best of them.
>
> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last
> year’s disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s
> chief executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets
> to
> plead for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic
> questions.
>
> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired
> by Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives
> had come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and
> living
> with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>
> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
> former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being
> run by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne,
> the
> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
> of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace
> guy and one Italian.
>
> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows
> convincingly how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when
> it seemed to
> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it
> aside in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>
> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
> early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
> good things, however, come to an end.
The end was always in the cards with American style free trade
capitalism. Japan, to this day, exercises protectionism to protect
home industries. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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External

Since: Oct 24, 2009 Posts: 36
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 6:50 pm
Post subject: Re:_Crash_Course:_The_American_Au [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 23/01/2010 4:50 PM, Chris Dawson wrote:
> Jim Higgins wrote:
>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>> Disaster
>> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>> Disaster By Paul Ingrassia
>> Random House $26, 320 pages
>>
>> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
>> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
>> year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
>> translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
>> Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
>> economical and reliable.
>>
>> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement.
>> As the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble
>> over decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement,
>> they would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
>> initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
>> revival.
>> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
>> (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
>> mid-1990s) to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the
>> biggest
>> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
>> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>>
>> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
>> Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
>> years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
>> crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>>
>> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
>> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
>> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
>> the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
>> Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
>> exploded.
>> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
>> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
>> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
>> into the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a
>> Lockheed
>> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
>> arms race.
>>
>> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder
>> if GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
>> suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
>> Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
>> professionally managed US corporation.
>>
>> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
>> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
>> Cadillac and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in
>> the US postwar market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and
>> design – the latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the
>> boring,
>> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
>> Ford and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>>
>> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
>> their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
>> Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
>> came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability
>> were of secondary importance.
>>
>> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
>> Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
>> hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
>> companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>>
>> A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
>> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
>> Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
>> labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
>> liabilities.
>> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
>> but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
>> Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable
>> cars being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day –
>> were alien to American tastes.
>>
>> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
>> kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
>> that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a
>> matter of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>>
>> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the
>> Big Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce
>> decent cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks.
>> Eventually this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>>
>> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
>> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
>> and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at
>> confronting GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to
>> make the best of them.
>>
>> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last
>> year’s disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s
>> chief executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to
>> plead for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic
>> questions.
>>
>> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired
>> by Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives
>> had come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
>> with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>>
>> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
>> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
>> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
>> former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being
>> run by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne,
>> the
>> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
>> of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace
>> guy and one Italian.
>>
>> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows
>> convincingly how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when
>> it seemed to
>> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it
>> aside in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>>
>> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
>> early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
>> good things, however, come to an end.
>
> The end was always in the cards with American style free trade
> capitalism. Japan, to this day, exercises protectionism to protect
> home industries.
And Japan might be the next country to default.
You can't debt-spend or bailout to prosperity. But it can drag down
everyone else. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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External

Since: Oct 24, 2009 Posts: 55
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2010 8:52 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Once again our friend Canuck57 is telling us the sky is falling LOL
"Canuck57" wrote in message
> On 23/01/2010 4:50 PM, Chris Dawson wrote:
>> Jim Higgins wrote:
>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>> Disaster
>>> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>> Disaster By Paul Ingrassia
>>> Random House $26, 320 pages
>>>
>>> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
>>> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
>>> year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
>>> translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
>>> Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
>>> economical and reliable.
>>>
>>> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement.
>>> As the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble
>>> over decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement,
>>> they would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
>>> initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
>>> revival.
>>> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
>>> (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
>>> mid-1990s) to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the
>>> biggest
>>> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
>>> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>>>
>>> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
>>> Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
>>> years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
>>> crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>>>
>>> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
>>> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
>>> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
>>> the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
>>> Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
>>> exploded.
>>> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
>>> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
>>> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
>>> into the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a
>>> Lockheed
>>> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
>>> arms race.
>>>
>>> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder
>>> if GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
>>> suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
>>> Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
>>> professionally managed US corporation.
>>>
>>> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
>>> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
>>> Cadillac and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in
>>> the US postwar market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and
>>> design – the latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the
>>> boring,
>>> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
>>> Ford and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>>>
>>> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
>>> their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
>>> Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
>>> came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability
>>> were of secondary importance.
>>>
>>> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
>>> Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
>>> hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
>>> companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>>>
>>> A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
>>> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
>>> Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
>>> labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
>>> liabilities.
>>> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
>>> but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
>>> Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable
>>> cars being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day –
>>> were alien to American tastes.
>>>
>>> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
>>> kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
>>> that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a
>>> matter of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>>>
>>> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the
>>> Big Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce
>>> decent cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks.
>>> Eventually this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>>>
>>> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
>>> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
>>> and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at
>>> confronting GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to
>>> make the best of them.
>>>
>>> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last
>>> year’s disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s
>>> chief executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to
>>> plead for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic
>>> questions.
>>>
>>> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired
>>> by Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives
>>> had come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and
>>> living
>>> with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>>>
>>> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
>>> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
>>> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
>>> former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being
>>> run by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne,
>>> the
>>> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
>>> of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace
>>> guy and one Italian.
>>>
>>> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows
>>> convincingly how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when
>>> it seemed to
>>> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it
>>> aside in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>>>
>>> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
>>> early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
>>> good things, however, come to an end.
>>
>> The end was always in the cards with American style free trade
>> capitalism. Japan, to this day, exercises protectionism to protect
>> home industries.
>
> And Japan might be the next country to default.
>
> You can't debt-spend or bailout to prosperity. But it can drag down
> everyone else. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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| Back to top |
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External

Since: Oct 03, 2009 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Tue Jan 26, 2010 10:10 pm
Post subject: Re:_Crash_Course:_The_American_Automobile_Industry [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster
> By Paul Ingrassia
> Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> economical and reliable.
>
Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
years ago.
Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
"superiority".
Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
to check things out on his own.
American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
than America.
Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
of US nameplates.
Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
right". and they still make a better product than the US.
Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
> the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit revival.
>
They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
unions, or mismanagement.
> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
> to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and exploded.
>
A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
quality standards."
OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
parts in the past 5 years.
In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
sludging engines.
Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
week.
Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
> the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
> race.
>
> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
> GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> professionally managed US corporation.
>
> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
> and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
> market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
> and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
> their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
> Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
> came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability were
> of secondary importance.
>
> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
> Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
> hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
> companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>
> A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
> Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
> labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare liabilities.
>
> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
> but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
> Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable cars
> being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day – were
> alien to American tastes.
>
> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
> kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
> that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a matter
> of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>
> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the Big
> Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce decent
> cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks. Eventually
> this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>
> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
> and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at confronting
> GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to make the best of
> them.
>
> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last year’s
> disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s chief
> executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to plead
> for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic questions.
>
> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired by
> Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives had
> come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
> with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>
> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
> former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being run
> by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne, the
> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
> of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace guy
> and one Italian.
>
> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows convincingly
> how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when it seemed to
> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it aside
> in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>
> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
> early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
> good things, however, come to an end.
>
> --
> Civis Romanus Sum >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 23, 2010 Posts: 2
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 1:12 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Canuck57 wrote:
> On 23/01/2010 4:50 PM, Chris Dawson wrote:
>> Jim Higgins wrote:
>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>> Disaster
>>> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>> Disaster By Paul Ingrassia
>>> Random House $26, 320 pages
>>>
>>> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
>>> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler
>>> last year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen,
>>> usually translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble
>>> start, the Japanese companies had got better and better at making
>>> cars that were economical and reliable.
>>>
>>> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional
>>> improvement. As the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper
>>> into trouble
>>> over decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement,
>>> they would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new
>>> car or initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a
>>> Detroit revival.
>>> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making
>>> cars (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
>>> mid-1990s) to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the
>>> biggest
>>> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
>>> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>>>
>>> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a
>>> veteran Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit
>>> over the years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings
>>> whose lives were crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>>>
>>> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
>>> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
>>> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill
>>> by the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such
>>> as the Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down
>>> and exploded.
>>> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
>>> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
>>> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
>>> into the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a
>>> Lockheed
>>> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
>>> arms race.
>>>
>>> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to
>>> wonder if GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy
>>> to
>>> even suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan
>>> turned Billy Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome
>>> of the professionally managed US corporation.
>>>
>>> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
>>> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
>>> Cadillac and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in
>>> the US postwar market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and
>>> design – the latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the
>>> boring,
>>> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
>>> Ford and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>>>
>>> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments
>>> of their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and
>>> later Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately,
>>> Detroit came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and
>>> reliability were of secondary importance.
>>>
>>> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its
>>> provincialism. Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by
>>> the Big Three and hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became
>>> unthinkable that auto companies could be run by anyone but
>>> Midwestern “car guys”. A second vulnerability was the grip of the
>>> United Auto Workers (UAW)
>>> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the
>>> Big Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer
>>> out labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
>>> liabilities.
>>> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese
>>> invasion but also prevented it from responding effectively when it
>>> woke up. The Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the
>>> plain, reliable cars being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts
>>> of their day –
>>> were alien to American tastes.
>>>
>>> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have
>>> ceased kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio
>>> and showed that American workers could make high-quality cars. It
>>> was not a matter of nationality, it turned out, but of good
>>> management.
>>>
>>> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the
>>> Big Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce
>>> decent cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks.
>>> Eventually this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>>>
>>> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
>>> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in
>>> 2000 and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at
>>> confronting GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to
>>> make the best of them.
>>>
>>> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last
>>> year’s disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s
>>> chief executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private
>>> jets to plead for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even
>>> basic questions.
>>>
>>> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was
>>> fired by Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM
>>> executives
>>> had come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and
>>> living with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>>>
>>> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
>>> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
>>> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre,
>>> a former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is
>>> being run by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio
>>> Marchionne, the
>>> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit,
>>> redoubt of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one
>>> aerospace guy and one Italian.
>>>
>>> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows
>>> convincingly how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades
>>> when it seemed to
>>> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it
>>> aside in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>>>
>>> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of
>>> the early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and
>>> flair. All good things, however, come to an end.
>>
>> The end was always in the cards with American style free trade
>> capitalism. Japan, to this day, exercises protectionism to protect
>> home industries.
>
> And Japan might be the next country to default.
There is no indication of that. Their export markets are booming (as
are China's) and both countries continue to protect their home
markets - which is what the USA should be doing - but because
"protectionism" is a dirty word in a capitalist/free-market economy,
the USA will continue to suffer. If the USA played by the same
rules as Japan and China, they wouldn't be in this mess. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Oct 24, 2009 Posts: 55
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Wed Jan 27, 2010 4:24 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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But Japan and China would
"Chris Dawson" wrote in message
> Canuck57 wrote:
>> On 23/01/2010 4:50 PM, Chris Dawson wrote:
>>> Jim Higgins wrote:
>>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>>> Disaster
>>>> http://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>>>> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
>>>> Disaster By Paul Ingrassia
>>>> Random House $26, 320 pages
>>>>
>>>> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
>>>> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler
>>>> last year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen,
>>>> usually translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble
>>>> start, the Japanese companies had got better and better at making
>>>> cars that were economical and reliable.
>>>>
>>>> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional
>>>> improvement. As the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper
>>>> into trouble
>>>> over decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement,
>>>> they would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new
>>>> car or initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a
>>>> Detroit revival.
>>>> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making
>>>> cars (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
>>>> mid-1990s) to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the
>>>> biggest
>>>> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
>>>> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>>>>
>>>> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a
>>>> veteran Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit
>>>> over the years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings
>>>> whose lives were crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>>>>
>>>> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
>>>> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
>>>> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill
>>>> by the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such
>>>> as the Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down
>>>> and exploded.
>>>> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
>>>> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
>>>> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
>>>> into the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a
>>>> Lockheed
>>>> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
>>>> arms race.
>>>>
>>>> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to
>>>> wonder if GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to
>>>> even suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan
>>>> turned Billy Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome
>>>> of the professionally managed US corporation.
>>>>
>>>> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
>>>> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
>>>> Cadillac and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in
>>>> the US postwar market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and
>>>> design – the latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the
>>>> boring,
>>>> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
>>>> Ford and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>>>>
>>>> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments
>>>> of their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and
>>>> later Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately,
>>>> Detroit came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and
>>>> reliability were of secondary importance.
>>>>
>>>> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its
>>>> provincialism. Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by
>>>> the Big Three and hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became
>>>> unthinkable that auto companies could be run by anyone but
>>>> Midwestern “car guys”. A second vulnerability was the grip of the
>>>> United Auto Workers (UAW)
>>>> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the
>>>> Big Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer
>>>> out labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
>>>> liabilities.
>>>> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese
>>>> invasion but also prevented it from responding effectively when it
>>>> woke up. The Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the
>>>> plain, reliable cars being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of
>>>> their day –
>>>> were alien to American tastes.
>>>>
>>>> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have
>>>> ceased kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio
>>>> and showed that American workers could make high-quality cars. It
>>>> was not a matter of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>>>>
>>>> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the
>>>> Big Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce
>>>> decent cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks.
>>>> Eventually this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>>>>
>>>> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
>>>> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in
>>>> 2000 and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at
>>>> confronting GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to
>>>> make the best of them.
>>>>
>>>> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last
>>>> year’s disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s
>>>> chief executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private
>>>> jets to plead for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even
>>>> basic questions.
>>>>
>>>> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was
>>>> fired by Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM
>>>> executives
>>>> had come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and
>>>> living with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>>>>
>>>> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
>>>> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
>>>> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre,
>>>> a former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is
>>>> being run by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio
>>>> Marchionne, the
>>>> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit,
>>>> redoubt of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one
>>>> aerospace guy and one Italian.
>>>>
>>>> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows
>>>> convincingly how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades
>>>> when it seemed to
>>>> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it
>>>> aside in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>>>>
>>>> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of
>>>> the early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and
>>>> flair. All good things, however, come to an end.
>>>
>>> The end was always in the cards with American style free trade
>>> capitalism. Japan, to this day, exercises protectionism to protect
>>> home industries.
>>
>> And Japan might be the next country to default.
>
> There is no indication of that. Their export markets are booming (as
> are China's) and both countries continue to protect their home
> markets - which is what the USA should be doing - but because
> "protectionism" is a dirty word in a capitalist/free-market economy,
> the USA will continue to suffer. If the USA played by the same
> rules as Japan and China, they wouldn't be in this mess.
>
> >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 31, 2010 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:56 am
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for one,
will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again. My
experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever has
tarnished that brand name.
This, I think, is the point with many posts in this GM newsgroup. General
Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer satisfaction in
the past has alienated so many people and that legacy continues to haunt
their future.
"jr92" wrote in message
On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> Disaster
> By Paul Ingrassia
> Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> economical and reliable.
>
Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
years ago.
Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
"superiority".
Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
to check things out on his own.
American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
than America.
Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
of US nameplates.
Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
right". and they still make a better product than the US.
Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
> Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
> the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit revival.
>
They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
unions, or mismanagement.
> This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
> to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
> This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and exploded.
>
A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
quality standards."
OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
parts in the past 5 years.
In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
sludging engines.
Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
week.
Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
> There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
> the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
> race.
>
> One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
> GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> professionally managed US corporation.
>
> Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
> and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
> market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
> and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
> their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
> Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
> came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability were
> of secondary importance.
>
> Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
> Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
> hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
> companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>
> A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
> union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
> Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
> labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare liabilities.
>
> Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
> but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
> Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable cars
> being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day – were
> alien to American tastes.
>
> Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
> kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
> that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a matter
> of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>
> The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the Big
> Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce decent
> cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks. Eventually
> this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>
> The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
> intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
> and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at confronting
> GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to make the best of
> them.
>
> Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last year’s
> disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s chief
> executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to plead
> for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic questions.
>
> Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired by
> Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives had
> come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
> with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>
> The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
> bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
> Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
> former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being run
> by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne, the
> head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
> of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace guy
> and one Italian.
>
> A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows convincingly
> how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when it seemed to
> be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it aside
> in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>
> Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
> early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
> good things, however, come to an end.
>
> --
> Civis Romanus Sum >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Oct 24, 2009 Posts: 55
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 12:30 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Get real! Most Toyota were POS in the eighties as well. Would you compare
a 2010 Toyota to a 1980 as well? The vehicles from every manufacturer
today are pretty good. The only real difference is style and price.
"JimG" wrote in message
> The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for
> one, will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again.
> My experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever
> has tarnished that brand name. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 31, 2010 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 1:14 pm
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Reread my post. I think car quality has improved and, for the most part, is
on par across most current manufacturers. But I bought a Buick, not a
Toyota, during the '80s and that POS experience was disastrous.
There are many car manufactures to choose from today and my past experience
with a General Motors product will forever exclude GM from my future
consideration.
"Mike Hunter" wrote in message
> Get real! Most Toyota were POS in the eighties as well. Would you
> compare a 2010 Toyota to a 1980 as well? The vehicles from every
> manufacturer today are pretty good. The only real difference is style and
> price.
>
> "JimG" wrote in message
>
>> The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for
>> one, will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again.
>> My experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever
>> has tarnished that brand name.
>
> >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Oct 03, 2009 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Sun Jan 31, 2010 11:40 pm
Post subject: Re:_Crash_Course:_The_American_Automobile_Industry [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Jan 31, 1:56 am, "JimG" wrote:
> The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for one,
> will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again. My
> experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever has
> tarnished that brand name.
>
> This, I think, is the point with many posts in this GM newsgroup. General
> Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer satisfaction in
> the past has alienated so many people and that legacy continues to haunt
> their future.
The point you just made also is a reason many of us here in the GM
newsgroup feel insulted.
"General Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer
satisfaction"
This statement could have come from Consumer Reports, Edmunds, USA
Today, NBC, CBS, or a whole host of other media or magazine outlets.
You ever write for one of them?????
Yet, this statement is strictly based on bias and not objectivity.
"Quality"????? Consumer reports usually uses such terms as "fit and
finish" or "rattles" for examples of quality. They've slammed GM for
about 30 years on this, but just check a similar model Toyota in any
comparable era and see if the "Toys" are really any better.
Safety????? Other than the before-mentioned 45 years ago Corvair, any
stastical data obtained (deaths, injuries, crash test data) usually
shows GM on par with, or better than Toyota. If you count the problems
Toyota has had in the past few years, GM blows them off the charts,
safety-wise.
Customer Satisfaction???? CR really slanted surveys in favor of
Toyota years ago, but the problem with their surveys was that a blown
interior light carried the same weight as a blown engine, so there was
no real way to make much use of the surveys; but of course CR didn't
let that stop them.
I believe that Toyota is now the company who "alienates people and
tarnishes their reputation and haunts their future"
It will be interesting to see who these former customers will go to
for their next purchase, and how competing auto manufacters will court
them.
>
> "jr92" wrote in message
>
>
> On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
>
> > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > Disaster
> > By Paul Ingrassia
> > Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> > Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> > century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> > year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> > translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> > Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> > economical and reliable.
>
> Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
> years ago.
>
> Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
> perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
> "superiority".
>
> Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
> as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
>
> Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
>
> By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
> to check things out on his own.
>
> American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
> effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
>
> Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
> than America.
>
> Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
> doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
>
> Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
> of US nameplates.
>
> Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
> vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
>
> But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
> right". and they still make a better product than the US.
>
> Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
>
> Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
>
> > Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
> > the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> > decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> > would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> > initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit revival.
>
> They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
> unions, or mismanagement.
>
> > This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> > (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
> > to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> > deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> > descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
> Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
> vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
> of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
>
> > This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> > Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> > years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> > crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> > In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> > early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> > entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> > the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> > Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and exploded.
>
> A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
> in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
> quality standards."
>
> OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
> parts in the past 5 years.
>
> In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
> sludging engines.
>
> Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
> with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
>
> I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
> American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
> week.
>
> Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
>
> And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
>
>
>
> > There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> > focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> > with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
> > the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> > fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
> > race.
>
> > One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
> > GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> > suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> > Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> > professionally managed US corporation.
>
> > Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> > shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
> > and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
> > market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> > latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> > technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
> > and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> > Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
> > their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
> > Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
> > came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability were
> > of secondary importance.
>
> > Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
> > Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
> > hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
> > companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>
> > A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
> > union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
> > Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
> > labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare liabilities.
>
> > Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
> > but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
> > Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable cars
> > being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day – were
> > alien to American tastes.
>
> > Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
> > kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
> > that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a matter
> > of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>
> > The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the Big
> > Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce decent
> > cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks. Eventually
> > this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>
> > The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
> > intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
> > and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at confronting
> > GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to make the best of
> > them.
>
> > Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last year’s
> > disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s chief
> > executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to plead
> > for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic questions.
>
> > Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired by
> > Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives had
> > come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
> > with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>
> > The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
> > bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
> > Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
> > former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being run
> > by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne, the
> > head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
> > of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace guy
> > and one Italian.
>
> > A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows convincingly
> > how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when it seemed to
> > be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it aside
> > in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>
> > Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
> > early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
> > good things, however, come to an end.
>
> > --
> > Civis Romanus Sum- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text - >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 31, 2010 Posts: 5
|
(Msg. 12) Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 1:38 am
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I thank you if you think my writing style would suggest a past career in
journalism (actually, I had 34 years as an engineer with the telephone
company). My comments are not “based on bias” but entirely on my brief
ownership of a 1984 Buick Century wagon. I have detailed my experience with
this Buick POS in other threads in this newsgroup and do not think it of
value to vent details of these displeasures yet again.
The final paragraph in your reply to my post asks …”…who these former
customers will go to… “. Let me tell you my thoughts, because they
describe why GM is in such deep sh*t.
In 1984, I was search for a car so my wife could drive our children on her
errands. I had settled on a Buick Century wagon or a Volvo DL wagon. The
Buick was a pretty car while the Volvo was Spartan and the “drive away” cost
of Buick was $500 less and thus decided. We owned the dangerous, POS, Buick
for about 9 months before trading it in on a Volvo DL. My wife drove the
Volvo for 10 years (200K miles) before handing it off to our son who, at the
time, was on his way to college. He drove it for another two years and 50K
miles.
After the DL, I have purchased a Volvo 740 and 850. Each one driven
100K~150K miles before being handed off to one of the kids. Last summer I
purchased a Volvo V70. I have been happy with Volvos over the years
because each one has been satisfactory.
I owned the ’84 Buick for 9 months because it was a dangerous POS and will
never buy another GM. I have since owned four Volvo’s over the past 25 years
and each has been satisfactory. Should my most recent V70 purchase develop
problems, I would be looking for an alternative brand for my next purchase..
"jr92" wrote in message
On Jan 31, 1:56 am, "JimG" wrote:
> The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for
> one,
> will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again. My
> experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever has
> tarnished that brand name.
>
> This, I think, is the point with many posts in this GM newsgroup. General
> Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer satisfaction
> in
> the past has alienated so many people and that legacy continues to haunt
> their future.
The point you just made also is a reason many of us here in the GM
newsgroup feel insulted.
"General Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer
satisfaction"
This statement could have come from Consumer Reports, Edmunds, USA
Today, NBC, CBS, or a whole host of other media or magazine outlets.
You ever write for one of them?????
Yet, this statement is strictly based on bias and not objectivity.
"Quality"????? Consumer reports usually uses such terms as "fit and
finish" or "rattles" for examples of quality. They've slammed GM for
about 30 years on this, but just check a similar model Toyota in any
comparable era and see if the "Toys" are really any better.
Safety????? Other than the before-mentioned 45 years ago Corvair, any
stastical data obtained (deaths, injuries, crash test data) usually
shows GM on par with, or better than Toyota. If you count the problems
Toyota has had in the past few years, GM blows them off the charts,
safety-wise.
Customer Satisfaction???? CR really slanted surveys in favor of
Toyota years ago, but the problem with their surveys was that a blown
interior light carried the same weight as a blown engine, so there was
no real way to make much use of the surveys; but of course CR didn't
let that stop them.
I believe that Toyota is now the company who "alienates people and
tarnishes their reputation and haunts their future"
It will be interesting to see who these former customers will go to
for their next purchase, and how competing auto manufacters will court
them.
>
> "jr92" wrote in message
>
>
> On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
>
> > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > Disaster
> > By Paul Ingrassia
> > Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> > Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> > century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> > year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> > translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> > Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> > economical and reliable.
>
> Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
> years ago.
>
> Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
> perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
> "superiority".
>
> Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
> as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
>
> Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
>
> By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
> to check things out on his own.
>
> American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
> effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
>
> Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
> than America.
>
> Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
> doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
>
> Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
> of US nameplates.
>
> Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
> vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
>
> But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
> right". and they still make a better product than the US.
>
> Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
>
> Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
>
> > Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
> > the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> > decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> > would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> > initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
> > revival.
>
> They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
> unions, or mismanagement.
>
> > This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> > (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
> > to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> > deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> > descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
> Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
> vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
> of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
>
> > This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> > Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> > years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> > crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> > In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> > early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> > entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> > the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> > Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
> > exploded.
>
> A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
> in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
> quality standards."
>
> OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
> parts in the past 5 years.
>
> In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
> sludging engines.
>
> Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
> with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
>
> I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
> American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
> week.
>
> Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
>
> And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
>
>
>
> > There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> > focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> > with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
> > the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> > fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
> > race.
>
> > One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
> > GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> > suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> > Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> > professionally managed US corporation.
>
> > Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> > shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
> > and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
> > market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> > latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> > technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
> > and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> > Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream machines, embodiments of
> > their owners’ aspirations, left a gap that the Japanese, and later
> > Korean, automobile companies later exploited. Unfortunately, Detroit
> > came to believe that sizzle sold, while technology and reliability were
> > of secondary importance.
>
> > Two other factors made Detroit vulnerable. One was its provincialism.
> > Michigan became a one-industry state, dominated by the Big Three and
> > hundreds of auto parts suppliers. It became unthinkable that auto
> > companies could be run by anyone but Midwestern “car guys”.
>
> > A second vulnerability was the grip of the United Auto Workers (UAW)
> > union, led by Walter Reuther, who exploited the complacency of the Big
> > Three in the 1950s and 1960s, when money was flowing, to hammer out
> > labour deals that later produced vast pension and healthcare
> > liabilities.
>
> > Such forces not only made Detroit underestimate the Japanese invasion
> > but also prevented it from responding effectively when it woke up. The
> > Big Three maintained the comforting mantra that the plain, reliable cars
> > being built by Nissan and Toyota – the Model Ts of their day – were
> > alien to American tastes.
>
> > Ingrassia describes the moment in 1979 when Detroit should have ceased
> > kidding itself: when Honda built its first US plant in Ohio and showed
> > that American workers could make high-quality cars. It was not a matter
> > of nationality, it turned out, but of good management.
>
> > The SUV boom of the 1990s brought a stay of execution, allowing the Big
> > Three to prosper by switching from a losing struggle to produce decent
> > cars and instead make bulky, highly profitable, light trucks. Eventually
> > this avenue would be closed off by surging oil prices.
>
> > The tragic figure in this account is Rick Wagoner, an amiable,
> > intelligent executive who was appointed chief executive of GM in 2000
> > and eventually led it to near-bankruptcy. Wagoner baulked at confronting
> > GM’s structural problems head-on, and instead tried to make the best of
> > them.
>
> > Such complacency in the face of trouble finally backfired at last year’s
> > disastrous hearings in Washington at which the Big Three’s chief
> > executives – and the head of the UAW – arrived on private jets to plead
> > for a bailout of $25bn and were unable to answer even basic questions.
>
> > Despite this, GM’s board continued to back Wagoner until he was fired by
> > Barack Obama as the price of a government bailout. “GM executives had
> > come to believe that solving their problems was impossible and living
> > with them was inevitable,” Ingrassia writes.
>
> > The question now is whether outsiders, helped by debt-shedding
> > bankruptcy (resisted by Detroit until the end) can do better. Fritz
> > Henderson, Wagoner’s successor, has been pushed out by Ed Whitacre, a
> > former chief executive of AT&T and now GM’s chairman. Ford is being run
> > by Alan Mulally, a former Boeing executive, and Sergio Marchionne, the
> > head of Fiat, has taken over Chrysler. The line-up in Detroit, redoubt
> > of the Midwestern “car guys”, is now one telecoms guy, one aerospace guy
> > and one Italian.
>
> > A changing of the guard may not be enough. Ingrassia shows convincingly
> > how Detroit’s problems built up, even during decades when it seemed to
> > be doing well. It allowed Asian and European companies to shove it aside
> > in its own heartland, and now the Chinese are coming.
>
> > Detroit was not always a basket case. It was the Silicon Valley of the
> > early 20th century, a crucible of US product innovation and flair. All
> > good things, however, come to an end.
>
> > --
> > Civis Romanus Sum- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text - >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Oct 03, 2009 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Tue Feb 02, 2010 9:00 pm
Post subject: Re:_Crash_Course:_The_American_Automobile_Industry [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Feb 2, 1:38 am, "JimG" wrote:
> I thank you if you think my writing style would suggest a past career in
> journalism (actually, I had 34 years as an engineer with the telephone
> company). My comments are not “based on bias” but entirely on my brief
> ownership of a 1984 Buick Century wagon. I have detailed my experience with
> this Buick POS in other threads in this newsgroup and do not think it of
> value to vent details of these displeasures yet again.
>
I never thought nor meant to impy you are a journalist.
I only suggested the words you used to degrade GM products fit a
template that other "journalists" have used for years.
The public bought that template hook, line, and sinker, without really
checking out the facts, for years.
Now, it appears, the worm may be turning, if only slightly.
> The final paragraph in your reply to my post asks …”…who these former
> customers will go to… “. Let me tell you my thoughts, because they
> describe why GM is in such deep sh*t.
>
Well, being that you are a Volvo owner, as oppposed to a Toyota owner,
you really dont count as to what I was trying to say.
And, BTW, GM has been in "deep sh*t", for a long time, finacially
speaking.
I just wish the management, government, unions, and media would get
out of the way and let the PRODUCT speak for itself.
The end result might really be surprising.
> In 1984, I was search for a car so my wife could drive our children on her
> errands. I had settled on a Buick Century wagon or a Volvo DL wagon. The
> Buick was a pretty car while the Volvo was Spartan and the “drive away” cost
> of Buick was $500 less and thus decided. We owned the dangerous, POS, Buick
> for about 9 months before trading it in on a Volvo DL. My wife drove the
> Volvo for 10 years (200K miles) before handing it off to our son who, at the
> time, was on his way to college. He drove it for another two years and 50K
> miles.
>
Here we go again. Another disgruntled former GM owner who had a bad
experience 26 YEARS ago with ONE GM VEHICLE, and is suddenly an expert
as to the quality (or lack), that GM supposedly has TODAY.
Please tell me the car you bought was NEW, as opposed to a worn out,
abused car that so many other GM bashers on this group have bought and
used as "examples" of bad GM products.
In what way was the car dangerous??? Once again, any measurement used
back in the day, wether it be stastical data, or data used in crash
tests, showed GM products as safe as, or safer than, anything anyone
else at the time made.
And, BTW, I have owned about 30 GM products over the past 34 years.
More than a couple have gotten 200,000 miles.
I have lost exactly ZERO engines.
I have lost exactly ONE transmission ( It was at 155,000 miles on a
1976 Nova SS. I drove it about another 100,000 trouble free miles
before trading it. One of the biggest mistakes of my life, letting
that car go.)
Hell, I had a 1978 Trans Am that I abused terribly, and got over
200,000 miles on it.
I owned a 1987 Oldsmobile, the ugliest car I ever owned, that went
past 300,000 miles when I traded it.(Probably another mistake, but
non=engine parts were beginning to wear out, and I didn't want to
spend a bundle on fixing the car at this point)
> After the DL, I have purchased a Volvo 740 and 850. Each one driven
> 100K~150K miles before being handed off to one of the kids. Last summer I
> purchased a Volvo V70. I have been happy with Volvos over the years
> because each one has been satisfactory.
>
As I have been satisfied with my GM cars over the years. Only
difference is I have owned 30, while you bought one 26 years ago, and
I don't even know the whole story about IT.
> I owned the ’84 Buick for 9 months because it was a dangerous POS and will
> never buy another GM. I have since owned four Volvo’s over the past 25 years
> and each has been satisfactory. Should my most recent V70 purchase develop
> problems, I would be looking for an alternative brand for my next purchase..
>
And, it I were you, based on your wonderful track record with the
Volvo, I would simply stay there. But of course, you were the one who
dumped GM for good after a bad experience 26 years ago, so I guess I
could see you dumping Volvo if you had a problem, even though it
appears up to this point you have had a half million miles of good
experiences with them.
> "jr92" wrote in message
>
>
> On Jan 31, 1:56 am, "JimG" wrote:
>
> > The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for
> > one,
> > will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again. My
> > experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever has
> > tarnished that brand name.
>
> > This, I think, is the point with many posts in this GM newsgroup. General
> > Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer satisfaction
> > in
> > the past has alienated so many people and that legacy continues to haunt
> > their future.
>
> The point you just made also is a reason many of us here in the GM
> newsgroup feel insulted.
>
> "General Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer
> satisfaction"
>
> This statement could have come from Consumer Reports, Edmunds, USA
> Today, NBC, CBS, or a whole host of other media or magazine outlets.
> You ever write for one of them?????
>
> Yet, this statement is strictly based on bias and not objectivity.
>
> "Quality"????? Consumer reports usually uses such terms as "fit and
> finish" or "rattles" for examples of quality. They've slammed GM for
> about 30 years on this, but just check a similar model Toyota in any
> comparable era and see if the "Toys" are really any better.
>
> Safety????? Other than the before-mentioned 45 years ago Corvair, any
> stastical data obtained (deaths, injuries, crash test data) usually
> shows GM on par with, or better than Toyota. If you count the problems
> Toyota has had in the past few years, GM blows them off the charts,
> safety-wise.
>
> Customer Satisfaction???? CR really slanted surveys in favor of
> Toyota years ago, but the problem with their surveys was that a blown
> interior light carried the same weight as a blown engine, so there was
> no real way to make much use of the surveys; but of course CR didn't
> let that stop them.
>
> I believe that Toyota is now the company who "alienates people and
> tarnishes their reputation and haunts their future"
>
> It will be interesting to see who these former customers will go to
> for their next purchase, and how competing auto manufacters will court
> them.
>
>
>
>
>
> > "jr92" wrote in message
>
> >
> > On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
>
> > > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > > Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> > > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > > Disaster
> > > By Paul Ingrassia
> > > Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> > > Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> > > century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> > > year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> > > translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> > > Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> > > economical and reliable.
>
> > Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
> > years ago.
>
> > Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
> > perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
> > "superiority".
>
> > Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
> > as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
>
> > Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
>
> > By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
> > to check things out on his own.
>
> > American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
> > effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
>
> > Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
> > than America.
>
> > Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
> > doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
>
> > Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
> > of US nameplates.
>
> > Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
> > vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
>
> > But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
> > right". and they still make a better product than the US.
>
> > Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
>
> > Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
>
> > > Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement. As
> > > the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> > > decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> > > would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> > > initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
> > > revival.
>
> > They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
> > unions, or mismanagement.
>
> > > This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> > > (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the mid-1990s)
> > > to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> > > deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> > > descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
> > Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
> > vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
> > of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
>
> > > This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> > > Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> > > years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> > > crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> > > In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> > > early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> > > entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> > > the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> > > Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
> > > exploded.
>
> > A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
> > in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
> > quality standards."
>
> > OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
> > parts in the past 5 years.
>
> > In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
> > sludging engines.
>
> > Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
> > with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
>
> > I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
> > American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
> > week.
>
> > Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
>
> > And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
>
> > > There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> > > focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> > > with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey into
> > > the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> > > fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic arms
> > > race.
>
> > > One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder if
> > > GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> > > suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> > > Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> > > professionally managed US corporation.
>
> > > Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> > > shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile, Cadillac
> > > and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US postwar
> > > market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> > > latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> > > technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook Ford
> > > and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> > > Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream
>
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text - >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Feb 03, 2010 Posts: 8
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:21 am
Post subject: Re:_Crash_Course:_The_American_Automobile_Industry [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On 3 Feb, 16:40, "Mike Hunter" wrote:
> Why in the world would anybody judge todays fine cars with the ONE they
> purchased years ago.
They judge the company and the service they get.
What you look at is quality, price, service.
If the quality goes up it is fine.
If the price goes up that is something you can calculate.
The service you take into consideration and if it is bad it takes a
long time to repair if ever.
You listen to others and hear if service has improved and if it has
not then you stay away.
There is evidence that quality did improve in all or at least most
brands.
The service quite often given or sold by GM and its dealers remained
poor until the very end.
That is why GM died. >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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Since: Jan 31, 2010 Posts: 5
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:23 am
Post subject: Re: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to Disaster [Login to view extended thread Info.] Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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My point in all of this is that the selection of one's "next" car begins
while driving the "current" car off the dealer's lot for the first time.
If the current car performs well then that brand has a good chance of being
selected again. If the car performs poorly, then the customer is likely to
look elsewhere next time. And if the current car proves to be, in the
opinion of the owner, a dangerous POS then that brand is damned forever
more. This is not GM bashing, it’s just basic consumerism.
The Rodger Smith years at GM pissed off a lot of then-current owners which
turned away many future potential returning customers.
"jr92" wrote in message
On Feb 2, 1:38 am, "JimG" wrote:
> I thank you if you think my writing style would suggest a past career in
> journalism (actually, I had 34 years as an engineer with the telephone
> company). My comments are not “based on bias” but entirely on my brief
> ownership of a 1984 Buick Century wagon. I have detailed my experience
> with
> this Buick POS in other threads in this newsgroup and do not think it of
> value to vent details of these displeasures yet again.
>
I never thought nor meant to impy you are a journalist.
I only suggested the words you used to degrade GM products fit a
template that other "journalists" have used for years.
The public bought that template hook, line, and sinker, without really
checking out the facts, for years.
Now, it appears, the worm may be turning, if only slightly.
> The final paragraph in your reply to my post asks …”…who these former
> customers will go to… “. Let me tell you my thoughts, because they
> describe why GM is in such deep sh*t.
>
Well, being that you are a Volvo owner, as oppposed to a Toyota owner,
you really dont count as to what I was trying to say.
And, BTW, GM has been in "deep sh*t", for a long time, finacially
speaking.
I just wish the management, government, unions, and media would get
out of the way and let the PRODUCT speak for itself.
The end result might really be surprising.
> In 1984, I was search for a car so my wife could drive our children on her
> errands. I had settled on a Buick Century wagon or a Volvo DL wagon. The
> Buick was a pretty car while the Volvo was Spartan and the “drive away”
> cost
> of Buick was $500 less and thus decided. We owned the dangerous, POS,
> Buick
> for about 9 months before trading it in on a Volvo DL. My wife drove the
> Volvo for 10 years (200K miles) before handing it off to our son who, at
> the
> time, was on his way to college. He drove it for another two years and 50K
> miles.
>
Here we go again. Another disgruntled former GM owner who had a bad
experience 26 YEARS ago with ONE GM VEHICLE, and is suddenly an expert
as to the quality (or lack), that GM supposedly has TODAY.
Please tell me the car you bought was NEW, as opposed to a worn out,
abused car that so many other GM bashers on this group have bought and
used as "examples" of bad GM products.
In what way was the car dangerous??? Once again, any measurement used
back in the day, wether it be stastical data, or data used in crash
tests, showed GM products as safe as, or safer than, anything anyone
else at the time made.
And, BTW, I have owned about 30 GM products over the past 34 years.
More than a couple have gotten 200,000 miles.
I have lost exactly ZERO engines.
I have lost exactly ONE transmission ( It was at 155,000 miles on a
1976 Nova SS. I drove it about another 100,000 trouble free miles
before trading it. One of the biggest mistakes of my life, letting
that car go.)
Hell, I had a 1978 Trans Am that I abused terribly, and got over
200,000 miles on it.
I owned a 1987 Oldsmobile, the ugliest car I ever owned, that went
past 300,000 miles when I traded it.(Probably another mistake, but
non=engine parts were beginning to wear out, and I didn't want to
spend a bundle on fixing the car at this point)
> After the DL, I have purchased a Volvo 740 and 850. Each one driven
> 100K~150K miles before being handed off to one of the kids. Last summer I
> purchased a Volvo V70. I have been happy with Volvos over the years
> because each one has been satisfactory.
>
As I have been satisfied with my GM cars over the years. Only
difference is I have owned 30, while you bought one 26 years ago, and
I don't even know the whole story about IT.
> I owned the ’84 Buick for 9 months because it was a dangerous POS and will
> never buy another GM. I have since owned four Volvo’s over the past 25
> years
> and each has been satisfactory. Should my most recent V70 purchase develop
> problems, I would be looking for an alternative brand for my next
> purchase..
>
And, it I were you, based on your wonderful track record with the
Volvo, I would simply stay there. But of course, you were the one who
dumped GM for good after a bad experience 26 years ago, so I guess I
could see you dumping Volvo if you had a problem, even though it
appears up to this point you have had a half million miles of good
experiences with them.
> "jr92" wrote in message
>
>
> On Jan 31, 1:56 am, "JimG" wrote:
>
> > The quality of Asian/American cars may indeed now be on par but I, for
> > one,
> > will never buy another General Motors (or the new GM) product again. My
> > experience with a dangerous, POS Buick I purchased in the '80s forever
> > has
> > tarnished that brand name.
>
> > This, I think, is the point with many posts in this GM newsgroup.
> > General
> > Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer
> > satisfaction
> > in
> > the past has alienated so many people and that legacy continues to haunt
> > their future.
>
> The point you just made also is a reason many of us here in the GM
> newsgroup feel insulted.
>
> "General Motors' reckless disregard for quality, safety, and customer
> satisfaction"
>
> This statement could have come from Consumer Reports, Edmunds, USA
> Today, NBC, CBS, or a whole host of other media or magazine outlets.
> You ever write for one of them?????
>
> Yet, this statement is strictly based on bias and not objectivity.
>
> "Quality"????? Consumer reports usually uses such terms as "fit and
> finish" or "rattles" for examples of quality. They've slammed GM for
> about 30 years on this, but just check a similar model Toyota in any
> comparable era and see if the "Toys" are really any better.
>
> Safety????? Other than the before-mentioned 45 years ago Corvair, any
> stastical data obtained (deaths, injuries, crash test data) usually
> shows GM on par with, or better than Toyota. If you count the problems
> Toyota has had in the past few years, GM blows them off the charts,
> safety-wise.
>
> Customer Satisfaction???? CR really slanted surveys in favor of
> Toyota years ago, but the problem with their surveys was that a blown
> interior light carried the same weight as a blown engine, so there was
> no real way to make much use of the surveys; but of course CR didn't
> let that stop them.
>
> I believe that Toyota is now the company who "alienates people and
> tarnishes their reputation and haunts their future"
>
> It will be interesting to see who these former customers will go to
> for their next purchase, and how competing auto manufacters will court
> them.
>
>
>
>
>
> > "jr92" wrote in message
>
> >
> > On Jan 23, 9:56 am, Jim Higgins wrote:
>
> > > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > > Disasterhttp://www.ft.com/cms/s/2/78e355e0-06e0-11df-b058-00144feabdc0.html
>
> > > Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’s Road from Glory to
> > > Disaster
> > > By Paul Ingrassia
> > > Random House $26, 320 pages
>
> > > Japanese car companies, which overtook US ones in the early 21st
> > > century, leading to the bankruptcy of General Motors and Chrysler last
> > > year, used a method of industrial innovation called kaizen, usually
> > > translated as “continuous improvement”. From a humble start, the
> > > Japanese companies had got better and better at making cars that were
> > > economical and reliable.
>
> > Japanese kaizen ran into kabe ,or 'wall", as in "brick" wall many
> > years ago.
>
> > Their cars simply were no better than American nameplates, but
> > perception, led by the American media kept preaching about Japan's
> > "superiority".
>
> > Even though, by the early ninties, American nameplates were as least
> > as good as Japan by any apples to apples comparison.
>
> > Better fuel mileage, fewer recalls safer, etc.
>
> > By the late nineties, there was really no comparison, if one bothered
> > to check things out on his own.
>
> > American nameplates continued to become even more reliable, more fuel
> > effiecient, safer, faster and roomier.
>
> > Yet the perception continued that the Japanese made a better product
> > than America.
>
> > Now, during the first ten years of the new century, there is little
> > doubt that American nameplates are far superior than the Japanese.
>
> > Any comparisons that can be objectively made are decisively in favor
> > of US nameplates.
>
> > Add to the fact that Japan has recalled TENS OF MILLIONS of their
> > vechicles, and there can be little doubt who makes better products.
>
> > But, still, there are those who try to argue that Japan is "doing
> > right". and they still make a better product than the US.
>
> > Really pretty amazing, if you ask me.
>
> > Either stupid, naive, or biased, but still amazing.
>
> > > Meanwhile, Detroit perfected the technique of occasional improvement.
> > > As
> > > the Big Three – GM, Ford and Chrysler – slid deeper into trouble over
> > > decades of complacency, union obstructionism and mismanagement, they
> > > would occasionally stage a temporary recovery, with some new car or
> > > initiative prompting books and magazine articles about a Detroit
> > > revival.
>
> > They made many many many great new cars during his period, dispite the
> > unions, or mismanagement.
>
> > > This all proved to be illusory, with Detroit’s detour from making cars
> > > (ground that it had in effect ceded to foreign rivals by the
> > > mid-1990s)
> > > to producing “light truck” sports utility vehicles as the biggest
> > > deception of the lot. These were just upward blips on a long, steady
> > > descent from technological dominance to global laughing stock.
>
> > Literally tens of millions of light trucks and sport utility
> > vechicles were sold during this period. It GM sold "junk', these tens
> > of millions of vehicles would not have been sold.
>
> > > This is a familiar story adroitly retold by Paul Ingrassia, a veteran
> > > Wall Street Journal reporter who has written about Detroit over the
> > > years but maintains his sympathy for the human beings whose lives were
> > > crushed by this vast systemic failure.
>
> > > In his effort to isolate what went wrong, Ingrassia goes back to the
> > > early 20th century, when Detroit was a “Mecca for automotive
> > > entrepreneurs” such as Henry Ford. Things had clearly gone downhill by
> > > the 1970s, when Detroit’s quality standards suffered: cars such as the
> > > Chevrolet Corvair and Ford Pinto had reportedly broken down and
> > > exploded.
>
> > A Corvair hasn't been made in about 45 years. A Pinto hasn't been made
> > in about 35 years. Pretty bad examples for using America's "lack of
> > quality standards."
>
> > OTOH, Toyota has made millions of light trucks with rusting suspension
> > parts in the past 5 years.
>
> > In the past couple of years, they have sold millions of vechicles with
> > sludging engines.
>
> > Unless they have already stopped production, they have made vechicles
> > with sticking throttles in the past half hour.
>
> > I really have to laugh when idiots try to compare the failures of
> > American nameplates nearly 50 years ago to those that Japan made last
> > week.
>
> > Maybe Kaizen is not what it is cracked up to be.
>
> > And maybe a good American translation could be "has been."
>
> > > There were, however, warning signs before that, when Detroit’s early
> > > focus on technology began, by the 1950s, to give way to an obsession
> > > with marketing and design. Ingrassia makes an entertaining journey
> > > into
> > > the history of tail fins. In 1948, these were borrowed from a Lockheed
> > > fighter by Harley Earl, GM’s chief designer, leading to a stylistic
> > > arms
> > > race.
>
> > > One could trace it back further. Ingrassia’s account led me to wonder
> > > if
> > > GM was an aberration from the start. It sounds like heresy to even
> > > suggest it: business schools still study how Alfred Sloan turned Billy
> > > Durant’s rag-tag collection of brands into the epitome of the
> > > professionally managed US corporation.
>
> > > Sloan was, as Ingrassia says, “low-key, methodical and prudent” and
> > > shaped GM into a portfolio of car brands, including Oldsmobile,
> > > Cadillac
> > > and Buick, intended to serve “every purse and purpose” in the US
> > > postwar
> > > market. He also pioneered techniques of marketing and design – the
> > > latter under Earl – that lured customers away from the boring,
> > > technology-oriented Ford, with its black-only Model Ts. GM overtook
> > > Ford
> > > and became the car industry’s dominant institution.
>
> > > Yet Sloan’s vision of turning cars into dream
>
> ...
>
> read more »- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text - >> Stay informed about: Crash Course: The American Automobile Industry’ |
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