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External
Since: Sep 05, 2007
Posts: 21
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(Msg. 1) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 2:16 am
Post subject: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy
Archived from groups: alt>autos, others (more info?)
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I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
which last about 7 to 10 hours. Then they have the non-Amish
neighbors charge them, or use a gas generator. I was talking to one
of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
wheels. I told him that seems doable. That got me thinking. Wiring
a delco with built in regulator is easy. There are two problems.
1. Mounting it so a pulley can be connected to the wooden spoke wheel
hub. I can sort of see a means to attach a belt pulley, but the belt
would have to connect to a shaft or it would be outside too far.
2. Alternators will not charge until they reach a specific RPM. I
doubt the buggy wheels would reach that. This means a gear assembly
would be needed to increase the rpm. I also heard that some tractor
alternators charge at a lower RPM, so I have to check into that.
Anyone have any suggestions? What could I steal a simple gear unit
from? How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel? Has
anyone ever done anything like this?
I'm having fun with this project....
Alvin |
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External
Since: Sep 06, 2006
Posts: 6
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(Msg. 2) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:11 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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<alvinamorey RemoveThis @notmail.com> wrote in message
news:6ch5j356uk99qbhtqt108k8ookr3muu3gb@4ax.com...
>I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
> their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
> which last about 7 to 10 hours. Then they have the non-Amish
> neighbors charge them, or use a gas generator. I was talking to one
> of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
> wheels. I told him that seems doable. That got me thinking. Wiring
> a delco with built in regulator is easy. There are two problems.
>
> 1. Mounting it so a pulley can be connected to the wooden spoke wheel
> hub. I can sort of see a means to attach a belt pulley, but the belt
> would have to connect to a shaft or it would be outside too far.
>
> 2. Alternators will not charge until they reach a specific RPM. I
> doubt the buggy wheels would reach that. This means a gear assembly
> would be needed to increase the rpm. I also heard that some tractor
> alternators charge at a lower RPM, so I have to check into that.
>
> Anyone have any suggestions? What could I steal a simple gear unit
> from? How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel? Has
> anyone ever done anything like this?
>
> I'm having fun with this project....
Remember those bicycle lights that have a generator that rubs on the tire to
light the light? They might be AC output, so you'd need some diodes to charge
batteries, but they could be a good starting point. Add a "tire" to the
generator if the buggy wheels are not rubber. Obviously, the output current is
limited, so you either need small bulbs or multiple generators.
Bob |
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Since: Nov 08, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 3) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:13 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Nov 8, 10:37 am, cle... RemoveThis @nortelnetworks.com (Chris Lewis) wrote:
> According to HerHusband <unkn... RemoveThis @unknown.com>:
>
> > I don't know much about the Amish, but I thought the idea was to avoid
> > modern technology? Couldn't they use lanterns as was done before electrical
> > lights were available?
>
> It's not so much an avoidance of "modern technology", it's more of
> an avoidance of depending on outside resources. Electricity isn't
> as much of an issue as being connected to the grid is. Tho, it
> depends on "which" Amish you're talking about. There are different
> levels of interpretation, and different levels of willingness to
> adapt to the modern world.
>
> Eg: they won't have a car. But most won't turn down a ride in one
> if it's going somewhere they need to go, and some aren't shy about
> asking for a ride 
>
> Eg: many Amish in the US came from Canada (south west Ontario) when
> Canada imposed refrigeration requirements on dairy production. When the
> corresponding US states imposed refrigeration, some Amish moved either
> to states that didn't require it, or to Mexico. Others adapted and
> stayed where they are. Most Amish, for example, refuse to have a
> telephone. But as an example of "modern compromise", some will have an
> outdoor phone for calls pertaining to their dairy operation.
>
> My wife and her sister bed-and-breakfasted with Pennsylvania
> Amish farm families, and recounted the amusing incident where
> the Amish family's teenage daughter had to stand outside in the rain
> at the "dairy phone" to talk to one of her friends.
>
> I thought of bicycle generators (car-size alternators or generators
> will sometimes present too much load to the available horse power
> too.
>
> However, I don't think they'd be terribly effective long-term
> solutions. They'd always be diddling with them. Something
> simple and mostly maintenance free is better.
>
> Perhaps LED lights and a smallish solar panel. Should allow them
> to use smaller/cheaper batteries too.
> --
> Chris Lewis,
>
> Age and Treachery will Triumph over Youth and Skill
> It's not just anyone who gets a Starship Cruiser class named after them.
Sounds like a good community to have a way station with a few solar
panels and a few group owned batteries on charge, swap out your
discharged battery for a charged one along the way. Wouldn't need to
be any bigger than an outhouse. >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Aug 15, 2003
Posts: 29
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(Msg. 4) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 8:41 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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Alvin,
> I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
> their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
> which last about 7 to 10 hours. Then they have the non-Amish
> neighbors charge them, or use a gas generator. I was talking to one
> of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
> wheels.
I don't know much about the Amish, but I thought the idea was to avoid
modern technology? Couldn't they use lanterns as was done before electrical
lights were available?
Otherwise, I'd start with a switch to more efficient lighting so the
battery lasts longer.
I don't know if they still make them, but once upon a time you could get
lights for bicycles that were powered by a little generator that ran on the
top of the bike tire. Seems like it would be easy to adapt to a buggy.
Otherwise, maybe you could install a small gas powered generator? A hybrid
buggy? 
But it seems like it's getting away from the Amish ideals to me?
Anthony >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 5) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:05 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 02:16:53 -0600, alvinamorey.RemoveThis@notmail.com wrote:
>I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
>their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
>which last about 7 to 10 hours. Then they have the non-Amish
>neighbors charge them, or use a gas generator. I was talking to one
>of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
>wheels. I told him that seems doable. That got me thinking. Wiring
>a delco with built in regulator is easy. There are two problems.
>
>1. Mounting it so a pulley can be connected to the wooden spoke wheel
>hub. I can sort of see a means to attach a belt pulley, but the belt
>would have to connect to a shaft or it would be outside too far.
>
>2. Alternators will not charge until they reach a specific RPM. I
>doubt the buggy wheels would reach that. This means a gear assembly
>would be needed to increase the rpm. I also heard that some tractor
>alternators charge at a lower RPM, so I have to check into that.
>
>Anyone have any suggestions? What could I steal a simple gear unit
>from? How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel? Has
>anyone ever done anything like this?
>
>I'm having fun with this project....
>
>Alvin
One page PDF file for Amish Buggy LED lights - lumileds.com.
http://www.lumileds.com/pdfs/AmishBuggy0903F.PDF >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Apr 29, 2004
Posts: 38
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(Msg. 6) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:22 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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In article <6ch5j356uk99qbhtqt108k8ookr3muu3gb.TakeThisOut@4ax.com>,
<alvinamorey.TakeThisOut@notmail.com> wrote:
> Anyone have any suggestions?
Well I immediatly thought of solar panels but then had an idea about using
a small wind turbine. It would work night & day and put out about 2-6 Amps
@12v.
> How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel?
If there was enough clearance on the inside of the wheel between it & the
body, fix full pully wheels around the diameter and use a long belt. That
would give you the gearing you need without much loss in power or slippage.
I'll not to draw it in ASCII art
HTH
--
Terminal_Crazy
Mitch - 1995 Z28 LT1 M6 terminal_crazy.TakeThisOut@sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk
Lancashire England http://www.sand-hill.freeserve.co.uk/terminal_crazy/ >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Nov 08, 2007
Posts: 1
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(Msg. 7) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 9:44 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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<alvinamorey.RemoveThis@notmail.com> wrote
>I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
> their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
> of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
> wheels. I told him that seems doable. That got me thinking. Wiring
> Anyone have any suggestions? What could I steal a simple gear unit
> from? How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel? Has
> anyone ever done anything like this?
>
Ineresting! What comes t my mind is the old bicycle lights. You know, the
ones that run off the spokes hitting the wheels? They generaly stop when
you stop, but might that be somesort of lead? I've seen ones for sale that
charge a small accessory battery so it runs for a bit when stopped.
I'e also seen solar powered bicycle lights, charge during the day stuff. I
didnt have much luck with the one I got, but then I only had a west/south
facing window to charge it in ad seldom got 'direct sun'. They don't give
alot of light, but several of them might do the trick as well as fit the
lifestye? >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 8
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(Msg. 8) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:34 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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I would be looking to use LED style lights instead and a bicycle
generator with maybe a solar panel too. I also think that using
automotive stuff would weight too much and have too much drag. Most
modern alternators create way too much current for just lights
anyway. Even an older 40A alternator wouldn't be as good as say going
to Nashbar's or Performance's website and using bicycle stuff
instead. Maybe if these Amish had electrical rear defoggers that they
were using then you might be able to justify something like an
automotive alternator.
To the person who said something about why are they even using
electricity in the first place, they aren't always necessarily against
it. It's more of a self sufficiency type of thing (meaning that in
some Amish communities it's OK to use electricity for certain things
as long as you generate it yourself). >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Jun 08, 2007
Posts: 8
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(Msg. 9) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 10:39 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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External
Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 10) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:10 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:34:13 -0800, scott21230.DeleteThis@gmail.com wrote:
>I would be looking to use LED style lights instead and a bicycle
>generator with maybe a solar panel too.
Check out this buggy with amber flashers on front and rear. *
Buggy battery safety is important
* Ohio State University Fact Sheet
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations
http://ohioline.osu.edu/aex-fact/0596_4.html
The following fact sheets are available from Ohio State University
Extension:
Driving Safely in Amish Country, AEX 596
Buying the Right Battery for Your Buggy, AEX 596.1
Buggy Battery Safety, AEX 596.2
Buggy Highway Safety Tips for You and Your Family, AEX 596.3
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations, AEX 596.4
Pedestrian Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.5
Bicycle Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.6
Boosting Visibility of Ag Equipment, AEX 598
Additional Marking of Horse Drawn Vehicles = Additional Safety, AEX
598.1
http://www.ag.ohio-state.edu/~agsafety/ash/programs/am_pubs.html >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Oct 30, 2007
Posts: 5
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(Msg. 11) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:18 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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if they're going to bend the rules enough to put an alternator on the buggy,
THEY'd be better off buying some suitably sized solar panels to charge those
batteries during the day when not in use. I'm afraid by the time you geared
the alternator up with pulleys or gears, you'd have quite the drag on that
wheel. A typical GM self exciting alternator needs to spin about 2000 rpm
to get anything useful done.
steve
<alvinamorey.DeleteThis@notmail.com> wrote in message
news:6ch5j356uk99qbhtqt108k8ookr3muu3gb@4ax.com...
>I live near an Amish community. They are required to use lights on
> their horse drawn buggies at night. They use 12V marine batteries
> which last about 7 to 10 hours. Then they have the non-Amish
> neighbors charge them, or use a gas generator. I was talking to one
> of them and he said he would like to connect a car alternator to the
> wheels. I told him that seems doable. That got me thinking. Wiring
> a delco with built in regulator is easy. There are two problems.
>
> 1. Mounting it so a pulley can be connected to the wooden spoke wheel
> hub. I can sort of see a means to attach a belt pulley, but the belt
> would have to connect to a shaft or it would be outside too far.
>
> 2. Alternators will not charge until they reach a specific RPM. I
> doubt the buggy wheels would reach that. This means a gear assembly
> would be needed to increase the rpm. I also heard that some tractor
> alternators charge at a lower RPM, so I have to check into that.
>
> Anyone have any suggestions? What could I steal a simple gear unit
> from? How do I attach a pulley to a wooden hub, spoke wheel? Has
> anyone ever done anything like this?
>
> I'm having fun with this project....
>
> Alvin
> >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 12) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:19 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:34:13 -0800, scott21230 DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote:
>I would be looking to use LED style lights instead and a bicycle
>generator with maybe a solar panel too.
Check out this buggy with amber flashers on front and rear. *
Buggy battery safety is important
* Ohio State University Fact Sheet
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations
http://ohioline.osu.edu/aex-fact/0596_4.html
The following fact sheets are available from Ohio State University
Extension:
Driving Safely in Amish Country, AEX 596
Buying the Right Battery for Your Buggy, AEX 596.1
Buggy Battery Safety, AEX 596.2
Buggy Highway Safety Tips for You and Your Family, AEX 596.3
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations, AEX 596.4
Pedestrian Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.5
Bicycle Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.6
Boosting Visibility of Ag Equipment, AEX 598
Additional Marking of Horse Drawn Vehicles = Additional Safety, AEX
598.1
http://www.ag.ohio-state.edu/~agsafety/ash/programs/am_pubs.html >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 13) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:25 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:34:13 -0800, scott21230.RemoveThis@gmail.com wrote:
>I would be looking to use LED style lights instead and a bicycle
>generator with maybe a solar panel too.
Check out this buggy with amber flashers on front and rear. *
Buggy battery safety is important
* Ohio State University Fact Sheet
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations
http://ohioline.osu.edu/aex-fact/0596_4.html
The following fact sheets are available from Ohio State University
Extension:
Driving Safely in Amish Country, AEX 596
Buying the Right Battery for Your Buggy, AEX 596.1
Buggy Battery Safety, AEX 596.2
Buggy Highway Safety Tips for You and Your Family, AEX 596.3
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations, AEX 596.4
Pedestrian Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.5
Bicycle Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.6
Boosting Visibility of Ag Equipment, AEX 598
Additional Marking of Horse Drawn Vehicles = Additional Safety, AEX
598.1
http://www.ag.ohio-state.edu/~agsafety/ash/programs/am_pubs.html >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Sep 11, 2007
Posts: 9
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(Msg. 14) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 11:36 am
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)
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On Thu, 08 Nov 2007 02:16:53 -0600, alvinamorey.TakeThisOut@notmail.com wrote:
Check out this buggy with amber flashers on front and rear. *
Buggy battery safety is important
* Ohio State University Fact Sheet
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations
http://ohioline.osu.edu/aex-fact/0596_4.html
The following fact sheets are available from Ohio State University
Extension:
Driving Safely in Amish Country, AEX 596
Buying the Right Battery for Your Buggy, AEX 596.1
Buggy Battery Safety, AEX 596.2
Buggy Highway Safety Tips for You and Your Family, AEX 596.3
Buggy Lighting and Marking Recommendations, AEX 596.4
Pedestrian Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.5
Bicycle Safety in Amish Country,AEX 596.6
Boosting Visibility of Ag Equipment, AEX 598
Additional Marking of Horse Drawn Vehicles = Additional Safety, AEX
598.1
http://www.ag.ohio-state.edu/~agsafety/ash/programs/am_pubs.html >> Stay informed about: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy |
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External
Since: Jun 15, 2007
Posts: 2
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(Msg. 15) Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2007 12:46 pm
Post subject: Re: Connecting an Alternator to horse drawn buggy [Login to view extended thread Info.]
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