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Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus

 
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Robert Winters

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Since: Dec 26, 2007
Posts: 4



(Msg. 1) Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 10:38 am
Post subject: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus
Archived from groups: rec>autos>makers>vw>aircooled (more info?)

I could use some advice from the RAMVA experts on how to get my 1979
Bus (Westfalia Deluxe Camper) back in running condition. Last month
the Bus experienced severe hesitation and lurching and eventually
stopped and wouldn't start. Later that evening it started but had
restricted power and would lurch when put under load. I experienced
symptoms like this 20 years ago with my previous 1979 Bus, and the
problem was solved the first time by replacing the Air Flow Meter. A
recurrence was solved by replacing the temperature sensor.

This time, my mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and made a
number of other minor fixes to the fuel injection system. Nonetheless,
it still showed some hesitation and decreased responsiveness. Within a
week it failed completely preceded by the same lurching symptoms I
experienced when it first failed.

The Bus is now back in the shop in need of a solution. Though I
suspect the Air Flow Meter could be the problem, my mechanic wants to
replace the ECU - and he gererally knows these things far better than
I do. The problem is that my Bus is a 1979 California Bus, and many of
the fuel infection components are not compatible with the 1979 Federal
Bus (I still have my old 79 in the back yard).

There are several things I would like to know:
1) What source would you recommend for replacement parts?
Specifically, the ECU is Bosch 0280000182 with a VW ID # 039906021D
and the Air Flow Meter is, I believe, a Bosch 0280200022.
http://www.type2.com/library/fuel/ecuswap.htm gives some information
on the incompatibility of the ECU with the Federal 1979 Bus and
earlier years.

2) Since parts are getting harder to find, is there a recommended way
to replace much of the fuel injection system for this 79 Calif. Bus to
essentially make it a 79 Federal Bus or something else which would be
easier to maintain? Which components would have to be replaced? We're
leaning toward replacing just the malfunctioning part or parts, but
we're definitely considering other solutions.

The engine, by the way, was rebuilt in 2000 by Boston Bob and remains
in great shape.

-- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA

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Jan Andersson

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Since: Dec 22, 2007
Posts: 79



(Msg. 2) Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 1:50 pm
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Robert Winters wrote:
> I could use some advice from the RAMVA experts on how to get my 1979
> Bus (Westfalia Deluxe Camper) back in running condition. Last month
> the Bus experienced severe hesitation and lurching and eventually
> stopped and wouldn't start. Later that evening it started but had
> restricted power and would lurch when put under load. I experienced
> symptoms like this 20 years ago with my previous 1979 Bus, and the
> problem was solved the first time by replacing the Air Flow Meter. A
> recurrence was solved by replacing the temperature sensor.
>
> This time, my mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and made a
> number of other minor fixes to the fuel injection system. Nonetheless,
> it still showed some hesitation and decreased responsiveness. Within a
> week it failed completely preceded by the same lurching symptoms I
> experienced when it first failed.
>
> The Bus is now back in the shop in need of a solution. Though I
> suspect the Air Flow Meter could be the problem, my mechanic wants to
> replace the ECU - and he gererally knows these things far better than
> I do. The problem is that my Bus is a 1979 California Bus, and many of
> the fuel infection components are not compatible with the 1979 Federal
> Bus (I still have my old 79 in the back yard).
>
> There are several things I would like to know:
> 1) What source would you recommend for replacement parts?
> Specifically, the ECU is Bosch 0280000182 with a VW ID # 039906021D
> and the Air Flow Meter is, I believe, a Bosch 0280200022.
> http://www.type2.com/library/fuel/ecuswap.htm gives some information
> on the incompatibility of the ECU with the Federal 1979 Bus and
> earlier years.
>
> 2) Since parts are getting harder to find, is there a recommended way
> to replace much of the fuel injection system for this 79 Calif. Bus to
> essentially make it a 79 Federal Bus or something else which would be
> easier to maintain? Which components would have to be replaced? We're
> leaning toward replacing just the malfunctioning part or parts, but
> we're definitely considering other solutions.
>
> The engine, by the way, was rebuilt in 2000 by Boston Bob and remains
> in great shape.
>
> -- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA


How about going old skool, replace FI with good old carbs, even an
"upgrade" to 40mm dual Webers or dellortos? Won't be as 'advanced' as
FI, but it will be pretty much bullet proof once dialed in. No
electrical components to fail.

Or if EFI is a must, then maybe a MegaSquirt DIY kit would be a decent
choice. You have the jets, the ECU is maybe 200-300 dollars. Original
ECU is not used.

Jan

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Speedy Jim

External


Since: Nov 26, 2007
Posts: 40



(Msg. 3) Posted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Robert Winters wrote:
> I could use some advice from the RAMVA experts on how to get my 1979
> Bus (Westfalia Deluxe Camper) back in running condition. Last month
> the Bus experienced severe hesitation and lurching and eventually
> stopped and wouldn't start. Later that evening it started but had
> restricted power and would lurch when put under load. I experienced
> symptoms like this 20 years ago with my previous 1979 Bus, and the
> problem was solved the first time by replacing the Air Flow Meter. A
> recurrence was solved by replacing the temperature sensor.
>
> This time, my mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and made a
> number of other minor fixes to the fuel injection system. Nonetheless,
> it still showed some hesitation and decreased responsiveness. Within a
> week it failed completely preceded by the same lurching symptoms I
> experienced when it first failed.
>
> The Bus is now back in the shop in need of a solution. Though I
> suspect the Air Flow Meter could be the problem, my mechanic wants to
> replace the ECU - and he gererally knows these things far better than
> I do. The problem is that my Bus is a 1979 California Bus, and many of
> the fuel infection components are not compatible with the 1979 Federal
> Bus (I still have my old 79 in the back yard).
>
> There are several things I would like to know:
> 1) What source would you recommend for replacement parts?
> Specifically, the ECU is Bosch 0280000182 with a VW ID # 039906021D
> and the Air Flow Meter is, I believe, a Bosch 0280200022.
> http://www.type2.com/library/fuel/ecuswap.htm gives some information
> on the incompatibility of the ECU with the Federal 1979 Bus and
> earlier years.
>
> 2) Since parts are getting harder to find, is there a recommended way
> to replace much of the fuel injection system for this 79 Calif. Bus to
> essentially make it a 79 Federal Bus or something else which would be
> easier to maintain? Which components would have to be replaced? We're
> leaning toward replacing just the malfunctioning part or parts, but
> we're definitely considering other solutions.
>
> The engine, by the way, was rebuilt in 2000 by Boston Bob and remains
> in great shape.
>
> -- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA


I would be very surprised if this turns out to
be a bad ECU. If you decide to let the mech
replace the ECU, insist on a money-back if the
problem is not solved.

My first guess would have been the cyl head temp
sensor, but I guess that has been ruled out.

Bad AFM? Maybe, though failures usually result in
dodgy performance at certain throttle openings.

Often, poor contact in one of the plugs will cause
just the symptoms you are seeing. The AFM plug is
especially prone to this.

Don't forget ignition problems too. They can be
intermittent like this.

Swap the other '79 parts in place? I think that's a good
option. I'm pretty sure that you can simply plug the
other ECU and AFM in to the existing harness.

The oxy sensor won't do anything and (maybe) the full
throttle switch won't be effective. Shouldn't matter.

I don't see any downside to this swap, at least as a test.

On Type2.com, you can view the Bosch L-Jetronic FI Manual
and there are diagrams for both the Federal and Cali
models so you can compare the pinouts.

Speedy Jim
http://www.nls.net/mp/volks/
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Berg

External


Since: Dec 15, 2006
Posts: 88



(Msg. 4) Posted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:39 am
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Jan Andersson wrote:
> Robert Winters wrote:
>> I could use some advice from the RAMVA experts on how to get my 1979
>> Bus (Westfalia Deluxe Camper) back in running condition. Last month
>> the Bus experienced severe hesitation and lurching and eventually
>> stopped and wouldn't start. Later that evening it started but had
>> restricted power and would lurch when put under load. I experienced
>> symptoms like this 20 years ago with my previous 1979 Bus, and the
>> problem was solved the first time by replacing the Air Flow Meter. A
>> recurrence was solved by replacing the temperature sensor.
>>
>> This time, my mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and made a
>> number of other minor fixes to the fuel injection system. Nonetheless,
>> it still showed some hesitation and decreased responsiveness. Within a
>> week it failed completely preceded by the same lurching symptoms I
>> experienced when it first failed.
>>
>> The Bus is now back in the shop in need of a solution. Though I
>> suspect the Air Flow Meter could be the problem, my mechanic wants to
>> replace the ECU - and he gererally knows these things far better than
>> I do. The problem is that my Bus is a 1979 California Bus, and many of
>> the fuel infection components are not compatible with the 1979 Federal
>> Bus (I still have my old 79 in the back yard).
>>
>> There are several things I would like to know:
>> 1) What source would you recommend for replacement parts?
>> Specifically, the ECU is Bosch 0280000182 with a VW ID # 039906021D
>> and the Air Flow Meter is, I believe, a Bosch 0280200022.
>> http://www.type2.com/library/fuel/ecuswap.htm gives some information
>> on the incompatibility of the ECU with the Federal 1979 Bus and
>> earlier years.
>>
>> 2) Since parts are getting harder to find, is there a recommended way
>> to replace much of the fuel injection system for this 79 Calif. Bus to
>> essentially make it a 79 Federal Bus or something else which would be
>> easier to maintain? Which components would have to be replaced? We're
>> leaning toward replacing just the malfunctioning part or parts, but
>> we're definitely considering other solutions.
>>
>> The engine, by the way, was rebuilt in 2000 by Boston Bob and remains
>> in great shape.
>>
>> -- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA
>
>
> How about going old skool, replace FI with good old carbs, even an
> "upgrade" to 40mm dual Webers or dellortos? Won't be as 'advanced' as
> FI, but it will be pretty much bullet proof once dialed in. No
> electrical components to fail.
>
> Or if EFI is a must, then maybe a MegaSquirt DIY kit would be a decent
> choice. You have the jets, the ECU is maybe 200-300 dollars. Original
> ECU is not used.
>
> Jan

Uhh, allot of wantsers have been burned by the MegaSquirt, it takes
serious dedication and a high level of understanding F.i.

It is better to opt for something simple(as in entry level), like an
American made/supported make/system if you live in the U.S.A.

what's the name of the entry level unit, SDS?

I have a link somewhere if interested.

J.
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Lyle Beaulac

External


Since: Dec 29, 2007
Posts: 1



(Msg. 5) Posted: Sat Dec 29, 2007 2:36 pm
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Robert Winters" <Robert.RemoveThis@rwinters.com> wrote in message
news:1a923767-9b73-4b00-b246-0b05fa98bfa8@f3g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>I could use some advice from the RAMVA experts on how to get my 1979
> Bus (Westfalia Deluxe Camper) back in running condition. Last month
> the Bus experienced severe hesitation and lurching and eventually
> stopped and wouldn't start. Later that evening it started but had
> restricted power and would lurch when put under load. I experienced
> symptoms like this 20 years ago with my previous 1979 Bus, and the
> problem was solved the first time by replacing the Air Flow Meter. A
> recurrence was solved by replacing the temperature sensor.
>
> This time, my mechanic replaced the temperature sensor and made a
> number of other minor fixes to the fuel injection system. Nonetheless,
> it still showed some hesitation and decreased responsiveness. Within a
> week it failed completely preceded by the same lurching symptoms I
> experienced when it first failed.
>
> The Bus is now back in the shop in need of a solution. Though I
> suspect the Air Flow Meter could be the problem, my mechanic wants to
> replace the ECU - and he gererally knows these things far better than
> I do. The problem is that my Bus is a 1979 California Bus, and many of
> the fuel infection components are not compatible with the 1979 Federal
> Bus (I still have my old 79 in the back yard).
>
> There are several things I would like to know:
> 1) What source would you recommend for replacement parts?
> Specifically, the ECU is Bosch 0280000182 with a VW ID # 039906021D
> and the Air Flow Meter is, I believe, a Bosch 0280200022.
> http://www.type2.com/library/fuel/ecuswap.htm gives some information
> on the incompatibility of the ECU with the Federal 1979 Bus and
> earlier years.
>
> 2) Since parts are getting harder to find, is there a recommended way
> to replace much of the fuel injection system for this 79 Calif. Bus to
> essentially make it a 79 Federal Bus or something else which would be
> easier to maintain? Which components would have to be replaced? We're
> leaning toward replacing just the malfunctioning part or parts, but
> we're definitely considering other solutions.
>
> The engine, by the way, was rebuilt in 2000 by Boston Bob and remains
> in great shape.
>
> -- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA

Before you go to a great deal of trouble replacing the stock FI, first make
sure that you have eliminated *all* potential sources of vacuum leaks. Check
rubber seals and elbows closely for cracks that might not be obvious in a
cursory inspection. Inspect your hoses to make sure thay haven't cracked at
the ends or frayed in the middle. Check the torque on the mainifold-to-head
nuts. Check your injector seals. You get the idea. Nearly 30 years is a long
time to ask a rubber part to maintain any integrity.

On my '81 Vanagon (not too far removed from your '79) I had a recurring
"lurching" problem which I traced to a crack on the underside of the rubber
elbow which attaches to the upstream side of the Auxiliary Air Regulator.
After replacing the part with the vastly inferior piece currently available
from VW vendors the problem went away for a few months, then it returned.
Upon inspection of the "new" part, I found more cracks. I resigned myself to
buying these a few at a time, with the expectation that it was now a regular
maintenance item (until I figure out a better solution).

Hope that helps,
Lyle
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Robert Winters

External


Since: Dec 26, 2007
Posts: 4



(Msg. 6) Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:57 am
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

First of all, Happy New Year to all of the prized consultants on
RAMVA. Your advice on how to deal with my '79 California Bus has been
helpful and much appreciated, as always.

That said, my Bus is still in the shop awaiting whatever solution
eventually emerges - be it repair or replacement of the fuel injection
system (and any related ignition components). I still want to hear
more ideas on how best to proceed, though I suspect my mechanic Greg
will craft a solution of some sort soon enough (even if only just to
get the Bus out of his place!).

I'll post the details of whatever gets it running again properly when
the Big Day happens. I suspect this problem is not so rare and unique
and that whatever solution emerges may be helpful for various other
late-model Buses.

-- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA
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Lyle Beaulac

External


Since: Oct 23, 2006
Posts: 2



(Msg. 7) Posted: Tue Jan 01, 2008 10:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Advice Needed - 1979 California Bus [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

"Robert Winters" <Robert.RemoveThis@rwinters.com> wrote in message
news:88239119-5251-419b-a6af-67f9d8fa4768@n20g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> First of all, Happy New Year to all of the prized consultants on
> RAMVA. Your advice on how to deal with my '79 California Bus has been
> helpful and much appreciated, as always.
>
> That said, my Bus is still in the shop awaiting whatever solution
> eventually emerges - be it repair or replacement of the fuel injection
> system (and any related ignition components). I still want to hear
> more ideas on how best to proceed, though I suspect my mechanic Greg
> will craft a solution of some sort soon enough (even if only just to
> get the Bus out of his place!).
>
> I'll post the details of whatever gets it running again properly when
> the Big Day happens. I suspect this problem is not so rare and unique
> and that whatever solution emerges may be helpful for various other
> late-model Buses.
>
> -- Robert Winters, Cambridge MA

If you haven't already done so, check out www.ratwell.com. It's just about
the most comprehensive Web resource on the VW Bus.
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