98 accord needs oil pan

On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:02:46 -0500, Matthew wrote:

> I have been told by my servicing Honda dealer that my 1998 Accord EXV6 has
> an oil pan with a stripped drain plug and self tapping plugs which they are
> now using is only a temporary fix.
> The car has 110,000 miles on it and the dealer has done most ALL of its oil
> changes. I really though that only Jiffy Lube stripped Honda pans, not the
> dealers, but I can understand that a car with my mileage may have this
> issue. (?)

It should never happen unless the plug was put in cross-threaded, or it
was over-tightened. Find a new dealership to do your service.

>
> My dealer wants $130 for the pan and $250 installation. Seems excessive
> as an OEM pan is available on line for $48.00 from Majestic Honda!

That's the price of dealing with a dealer. You could try talking to the
service manager, to see if he will cut you a break, since the damage was
obviously done by his shop...
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

"Joe LaVigne" wrote in message

> On Mon, 13 Nov 2006 23:02:46 -0500, Matthew wrote:
>
>> I have been told by my servicing Honda dealer that my 1998 Accord EXV6
>> has
>> an oil pan with a stripped drain plug and self tapping plugs which they
>> are
>> now using is only a temporary fix.
>> The car has 110,000 miles on it and the dealer has done most ALL of its
>> oil
>> changes. I really though that only Jiffy Lube stripped Honda pans, not
>> the
>> dealers, but I can understand that a car with my mileage may have this
>> issue. (?)
>
> It should never happen unless the plug was put in cross-threaded, or it
> was over-tightened. Find a new dealership to do your service.
>
I'm not so sure. We are the second owners of my daughter's '93 Accord, and
the previous owner relied too much on Midas for service (original timing
belt at 163K miles!) Still, we made it through about half a dozen
do-it-myself oil changes before the oil drain bolt stripped. Had Midas been
overtorqueing the bolt and it finally caught up with me? Dunno. But I
suspect even torqueing "by the book" results in gradual erosion of the pan
threads. I can testify that a mechanic can do it exactly right, even several
times, and still the bolt may strip. It also seems to be a uniquely Honda
phenomenon; I haven't seen any other make that has this problem... unless
cross-threaded, of course.

NAPA carries single and double oversize drain bolts for Hondas. Hers now has
a single oversize and it has done well through a handful of oil changes. My
only complaint is that it doesn't thread in very far by hand the way the
original did, but it does thread far enough to ensure it isn't
cross-threading. I recommend leaving it at as-is unless and until there is
another stripped thread. If that happens, at least it won't be with a new
pan!

Mike
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

"Michael Pardee" wrote in



<snip>

> We are the second owners of my daughter's '93 Accord,
> and the previous owner relied too much on Midas for service (original
> timing belt at 163K miles!) Still, we made it through about half a
> dozen do-it-myself oil changes before the oil drain bolt stripped. Had
> Midas been overtorqueing the bolt and it finally caught up with me?
> Dunno. But I suspect even torqueing "by the book" results in gradual
> erosion of the pan threads.



It does not. The single and sole cause of stripped oil pan drain bolt
threads is overtorquing.

Too many mechanics (even dealership ones, unfortunately) hand-torque the
bolt to save time, usually overdoing it by a considerable margin.

The first oil pan in my Integra made it barely 3 years with oil changes
exclusively by an Acura dealer. The second, well...It's still on there.



> I can testify that a mechanic can do it
> exactly right, even several times, and still the bolt may strip.



Unlikely. Do it right, right from the start, and that bolt will go a
long long time before it strips. And I mean a decade or more, or well
over 100 oil changes.



> It
> also seems to be a uniquely Honda phenomenon;



It is. It has to do with the way Honda makes the threads in the oil pan.

The official Honda cure is Heli-Coil.



--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

"TeGGeR®" wrote in


> "Michael Pardee" wrote in
>
>
>
><snip>
>
>> We are the second owners of my daughter's '93 Accord,
>> and the previous owner relied too much on Midas for service (original
>> timing belt at 163K miles!) Still, we made it through about half a
>> dozen do-it-myself oil changes before the oil drain bolt stripped. Had
>> Midas been overtorqueing the bolt and it finally caught up with me?
>> Dunno. But I suspect even torqueing "by the book" results in gradual
>> erosion of the pan threads.
>
>
>
> It does not. The single and sole cause of stripped oil pan drain bolt
> threads is overtorquing.
>
> Too many mechanics (even dealership ones, unfortunately) hand-torque the
> bolt to save time, usually overdoing it by a considerable margin.
>
> The first oil pan in my Integra made it barely 3 years with oil changes
> exclusively by an Acura dealer. The second, well...It's still on there.
>
>
>
>> I can testify that a mechanic can do it
>> exactly right, even several times, and still the bolt may strip.
>
>
>
> Unlikely. Do it right, right from the start, and that bolt will go a
> long long time before it strips. And I mean a decade or more, or well
> over 100 oil changes.
>
>
>
>> It
>> also seems to be a uniquely Honda phenomenon;
>
>
>
> It is. It has to do with the way Honda makes the threads in the oil pan.
>
> The official Honda cure is Heli-Coil.
>
>
>

Then perhaps this?

http://www.fumotovalve.com/

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

Jim Yanik wrote:
> "TeGGeR�" wrote in
>
>
>> "Michael Pardee" wrote in
>>
>>
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>>> We are the second owners of my daughter's '93 Accord,
>>> and the previous owner relied too much on Midas for service (original
>>> timing belt at 163K miles!) Still, we made it through about half a
>>> dozen do-it-myself oil changes before the oil drain bolt stripped. Had
>>> Midas been overtorqueing the bolt and it finally caught up with me?
>>> Dunno. But I suspect even torqueing "by the book" results in gradual
>>> erosion of the pan threads.
>>
>>
>> It does not. The single and sole cause of stripped oil pan drain bolt
>> threads is overtorquing.
>>
>> Too many mechanics (even dealership ones, unfortunately) hand-torque the
>> bolt to save time, usually overdoing it by a considerable margin.
>>
>> The first oil pan in my Integra made it barely 3 years with oil changes
>> exclusively by an Acura dealer. The second, well...It's still on there.
>>
>>
>>
>>> I can testify that a mechanic can do it
>>> exactly right, even several times, and still the bolt may strip.
>>
>>
>> Unlikely. Do it right, right from the start, and that bolt will go a
>> long long time before it strips. And I mean a decade or more, or well
>> over 100 oil changes.
>>
>>
>>
>>> It
>>> also seems to be a uniquely Honda phenomenon;
>>
>>
>> It is. It has to do with the way Honda makes the threads in the oil pan.
>>
>> The official Honda cure is Heli-Coil.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Then perhaps this?
>
> http://www.fumotovalve.com/
>
over my dead body.
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

jim beam wrote:


>> http://www.fumotovalve.com/

Fram had something like this for sale many years ago. I bought one, but
never installed it. Possibility of a bad outcome scared me too much.
bob
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

Jim Yanik wrote in


> "TeGGeR®" wrote in
>

>> It has to do with the way Honda makes the threads in the oil
>> pan.
>>
>> The official Honda cure is Heli-Coil.
>>
>>
>>
>
> Then perhaps this?
>
> http://www.fumotovalve.com/
>



Or just torque the damn bolt properly.

Last time I had the local dealer do an oil change (some time last year) I
noticed a notation on the invoice that stated the drain bolt had been
"hand-torqued". I thought, uh-oh...What's the opposite of that?

--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

TeGGeR® wrote:

>
> Last time I had the local dealer do an oil change (some time last year) I
> noticed a notation on the invoice that stated the drain bolt had been
> "hand-torqued". I thought, uh-oh...What's the opposite of that?
>

May it mean that they DIDN"T use one of those fancy new extensions that
apply the correct torque automatically? Just a guess. bob
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

Well, I already spoke to the service manager at my dealer who after quoting
me the outrageous price of $380 I very politely explained to him that HIS
service dept is likely responsible for the stripped plug. His response was
NO, it was age and the best he would do is discount the bill a whipping
10%!!!
When Jiffy Lube did it to my '88 Accord I complained to corporate who
promptly and without argument reimbursed me for my new pan. But my
dealer.....?????
Now I am pissed and am ready to go corporate to Honda as well.

Any suggestions on that route??
Thanks again,
Matthew


"N.E.Ohio Bob" wrote in message

> TeGGeR® wrote:
>
> >
> > Last time I had the local dealer do an oil change (some time last year)
I
> > noticed a notation on the invoice that stated the drain bolt had been
> > "hand-torqued". I thought, uh-oh...What's the opposite of that?
> >
>
> May it mean that they DIDN"T use one of those fancy new extensions that
> apply the correct torque automatically? Just a guess. bob
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

I called American Honda and opened a case.
Awaiting a response...


"Matthew" wrote in message

> Well, I already spoke to the service manager at my dealer who after
quoting
> me the outrageous price of $380 I very politely explained to him that HIS
> service dept is likely responsible for the stripped plug. His response was
> NO, it was age and the best he would do is discount the bill a whipping
> 10%!!!
> When Jiffy Lube did it to my '88 Accord I complained to corporate who
> promptly and without argument reimbursed me for my new pan. But my
> dealer.....?????
> Now I am pissed and am ready to go corporate to Honda as well.
>
> Any suggestions on that route??
> Thanks again,
> Matthew
>
>
> "N.E.Ohio Bob" wrote in message
>
> > TeGGeR® wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Last time I had the local dealer do an oil change (some time last
year)
> I
> > > noticed a notation on the invoice that stated the drain bolt had been
> > > "hand-torqued". I thought, uh-oh...What's the opposite of that?
> > >
> >
> > May it mean that they DIDN"T use one of those fancy new extensions that
> > apply the correct torque automatically? Just a guess. bob
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

"N.E.Ohio Bob" wrote in


> jim beam wrote:
>
>
>>> http://www.fumotovalve.com/
>
> Fram had something like this for sale many years ago. I bought
> one, but
> never installed it. Possibility of a bad outcome scared me too much.
> bob
>


What scares me more than anything else is that the thing hangs down
below the oil pan bottom. Can you say "exposed", boys and girls?

--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

On Tue, 14 Nov 2006 09:51:54 +0000 (UTC), Joe LaVigne
wrote:
>That's the price of dealing with a dealer. You could try talking to the
>service manager, to see if he will cut you a break, since the damage was
>obviously done by his shop...

Dealer swore to me it's natural after ten years or so, ... no?

J.
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan 

JXStern wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Nov 2006 09:51:54 +0000 (UTC), Joe LaVigne
> wrote:
>> That's the price of dealing with a dealer. You could try talking to the
>> service manager, to see if he will cut you a break, since the damage was
>> obviously done by his shop...
>
> Dealer swore to me it's natural after ten years or so, ... no?
>
> J.
>
ten years of what? ten years of over-torque, yes, it'll fail. 10 years
of correct usage? no.
 >> Stay informed about: 98 accord needs oil pan