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97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 troub..

 
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ChaoticEntity

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Since: Sep 09, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 1) Posted: Sun Sep 09, 2007 10:32 pm
Post subject: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble code
Archived from groups: alt>autos>honda (more info?)

Hello, I just changed the timing belt of a 97 civic dx hatch, we
screwed up the timing the first time(crankshaft pully moved) adjusted
it again and set the line on the pulley to the arrow on the block and
the up arrow was set for the camshaft at the top. this was double
checked to make sure it was accurate.

On reassembly valve clearences were adjusted to factory spec.

I took a timing light to it and at ~2.5-3k rpm the timing lines up
with the red mark on the pulley. The gas can be held and it'll keep
running as long as the rpms are ~2k or higher, any lower and it stalls
out. Went for a short drive, car is totally gutless till ~5-6k rpm and
even then it's weak.

when we got everything back together and started the car the check
engine light came on, jumped the ecu and got a 72 code (Misfire on
cylinder #2)



I'm thinking at this point that I must have made an error when the
timing belt was put on and the timing is off there. If that's not the
case then I have no idea why it's idle is so bad.

I reset the ECU by pulling the battery connectors for a good 10min or
so, next time it started the 72 code came back shortly.


Any ideas how to get the car to idle correctly and what might be going
on?

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jim beam

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Since: Aug 20, 2006
Posts: 1210



(Msg. 2) Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 5:52 am
Post subject: Re: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

ChaoticEntity DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote:
> Hello, I just changed the timing belt of a 97 civic dx hatch, we
> screwed up the timing the first time(crankshaft pully moved) adjusted
> it again and set the line on the pulley to the arrow on the block and
> the up arrow was set for the camshaft at the top. this was double
> checked to make sure it was accurate.

you need to check it again after the belt has been tensioned - the
symptoms say you're out.

>
> On reassembly valve clearences were adjusted to factory spec.
>
> I took a timing light to it and at ~2.5-3k rpm the timing lines up
> with the red mark on the pulley. The gas can be held and it'll keep
> running as long as the rpms are ~2k or higher, any lower and it stalls
> out. Went for a short drive, car is totally gutless till ~5-6k rpm and
> even then it's weak.

timing belt is set wrong. the cam gear is not just "up", but two marks
must align with the head surface.


>
> when we got everything back together and started the car the check
> engine light came on, jumped the ecu and got a 72 code (Misfire on
> cylinder #2)
>
>
>
> I'm thinking at this point that I must have made an error when the
> timing belt was put on and the timing is off there. If that's not the
> case then I have no idea why it's idle is so bad.
>
> I reset the ECU by pulling the battery connectors for a good 10min or
> so, next time it started the 72 code came back shortly.
>
>
> Any ideas how to get the car to idle correctly and what might be going
> on?
>

be logical - it worked before the belt change, it doesn't work after.
cam timing is the most likely error.

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Tegger

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Since: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 1587



(Msg. 3) Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:55 am
Post subject: Re: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble code [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

ChaoticEntity DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote in news:1189402352.188080.6440@
57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com:

> Hello, I just changed the timing belt of a 97 civic dx hatch, we
> screwed up the timing the first time(crankshaft pully moved) adjusted
> it again and set the line on the pulley to the arrow on the block and
> the up arrow was set for the camshaft at the top. this was double
> checked to make sure it was accurate.
>
> On reassembly valve clearences were adjusted to factory spec.



How far out were they when you started? If they were WAY out, then your
belt is still on there incorrectly.


>
> I took a timing light to it and at ~2.5-3k rpm the timing lines up
> with the red mark on the pulley.



"Red mark"? Is this the middle one of the group of three? Or is it the one
that's all by itself?




--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
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Tegger

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Since: Nov 24, 2006
Posts: 1587



(Msg. 4) Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:55 am
Post subject: Re: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble code [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

> ChaoticEntity DeleteThis @gmail.com wrote in news:1189402352.188080.6440@
> 57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com:
>

>
>
>>
>> I took a timing light to it and at ~2.5-3k rpm the timing lines up
>> with the red mark on the pulley.
>
>


I missed something before...

The timing should be at the middle mark of the three
at **IDLE** with the Service Check connector shorted.

At 2500rpm it will be WAY off from ANY of the marks! You've done something
seriously wrong here.

Did you have a factory service manual before doing all the work?

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/
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jim beam

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Since: Aug 20, 2006
Posts: 1210



(Msg. 5) Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 7:55 am
Post subject: Re: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

Tegger wrote:
>> ChaoticEntity.DeleteThis@gmail.com wrote in news:1189402352.188080.6440@
>> 57g2000hsv.googlegroups.com:
>>
>
>>
>>> I took a timing light to it and at ~2.5-3k rpm the timing lines up
>>> with the red mark on the pulley.
>>
>
>
> I missed something before...
>
> The timing should be at the middle mark of the three
> at **IDLE** with the Service Check connector shorted.
>
> At 2500rpm it will be WAY off from ANY of the marks! You've done something
> seriously wrong here.

no kidding. shouldn't have to touch the ignition timing if the belt is
set right.


>
> Did you have a factory service manual before doing all the work?
>
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ChaoticEntity

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Since: Sep 09, 2007
Posts: 2



(Msg. 6) Posted: Mon Sep 10, 2007 9:58 pm
Post subject: Re: 97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble code [Login to view extended thread Info.]
Archived from groups: per prev. post (more info?)

ok, it was disassembled and put back together from the service manual
step by step. (misunderstood where crank TDC was, stupid mistake)


I double checked the timing was correct when the belt was put on, that
is that the cam marks lined up with the block and the crank pulley's
white TDC mark was lined up with the V notch and the point(it was dead
on) Then followed the tension procedure and after everything was
tightened the marks were checked again, this time they were near
perfect(the cam was perfect, the crank TDC mark was ~1mm from the
point(IE well within 2deg)

Now that it has been reassembled the timing is dead on that middle
(red) mark @ ~750-800rpm. This is a canadian model D16y7 so the idle
should be 750+-

Still runs lousy, no power, idles rough then dies. If you put it in
gear or anything it just wants to die on you. has almost no power till
~3-4k rpm and even after that it's far less than normal...

any ideas?
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