289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated

On Mar 15, 6:22�pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
> Hi Guys,
> The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
> few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
> Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
> barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM.  More recently I have noted that when you
> accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
> when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
> 5 pounds.  When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
> noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
> rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
> further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
> crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
> something else. Any ideas??????????
> -George-
> 63 GT Hawk
> 63 Champ
> 56 (very sick) Sky Hawk

Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
coolant.
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

Hi Guys,
I did just notice a bit of gas leaking through the vent hole in the
fuel pump so I do know I have to repalce that, and there is zero
coolant in the oil - I check for that every time I pull the dipstick
or dump out the old oil. I also change oil every 1000 miles and had
de-sludged the engine with Mystery Oil a few months back. However, low
pressure has always been an issue with this engine and I had been told
by one or two people that "low oil pressure was a common situation
with engines back then and if you don't hear anything weird, forget
about it". I never really felt very comfortable with that theorum,
especially after my 62 GT split a crankshaft after months of marginal
oil pressure. The engine had been displaying a raping sound when
fully warmed up at speeds approaching 3000 RPM on the highway, AND the
oil pressure had been dropping on throttle ups are months now. The
other day I finally noticed that the rapping was getting louder and
the oil pressure at 2000 RPM was lower than it had been - and is now
below the 1000 pound per 10,000 RPM rule. I figure it probably is time
for new main bearings, and connecting rod bearings; these I can do by
dropping the oil pan and replacing them myself without pulling the
engine. I am hoping to be able to avoid the cam bearings because I'm
not equipped to pull the engine and at that point I'd probably just
arrange to have the engine pulled & rebuilt. Methinks that the oil
pressure gauge flutter of several pounds at idle and flutter on
acceleration is an indicator that the crankshaft is being torqued by
the force of the pistons / rods under firing stroke as a result of
excessive bearing clearance, and replacing the crank and connecting
rod bearings with perhaps 1 under sould address that. FYI: the engine
has 99,000 miles on it, and to my knowledge has never been rebuilt.

See, my thing is this: I want to use the opportunity to do some of the
work myself and learn - thru - doing, but I don't want to spend the
next year doing this, nor do I want to have the engine totally rebuilt
if it doesn't absolutely need it. So I'm looking to get my
intellectual ducks in order and glean a little insight from you guys
who have been there-done that. I think Stude V8's are the perfect
engine to learn by doing on, since they are such friggin great engines
and so bulletproof.
-George-
63 GT Hawk
63 champ
56 SkyHawk

On Mar 16, 3:38 pm, "studegary" wrote:
> On Mar 15, 6:22?pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
>
>
>
> > Hi Guys,
> > The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
> > few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
> > Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
> > barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM. ?More recently I have noted that when you
> > accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
> > when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
> > 5 pounds. ?When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
> > noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
> > rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
> > further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
> > crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
> > something else. Any ideas??????????
> > -George-
> > 63 GT Hawk
> > 63 Champ
> > 56 (very sick) Sky Hawk
>
> Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
> certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
> coolant.
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

On Mar 16, 3:52�pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
> reichsrundfunk wrote:
> > Hi Guys,
> > I did just notice a bit of gas leaking through the vent hole in the
> > fuel pump so I do know I have to repalce that, and there is zero
> > coolant in the oil - I check for that every time I pull the dipstick
> > or dump out the old oil.  I also change oil every 1000 miles and had
> > de-sludged the engine with Mystery Oil a few months back. However, low
> > pressure has always been an issue with this engine and I had been told
> > by one or two people that "low oil pressure was a common situation
> > with engines back then and if you don't hear anything weird, forget
> > about it".  I never really felt very comfortable with that theorum,
> > especially after my 62 GT split a crankshaft after months of marginal
> > oil pressure.  The engine had been displaying a raping sound when
> > fully warmed up at speeds approaching 3000 RPM on the highway, AND the
> > oil pressure had been dropping on throttle ups are months now. The
> > other day I finally noticed that the rapping was getting louder and
> > the oil pressure at 2000 RPM was lower than it had been - and is now
> > below the 1000 pound per 10,000 RPM rule. I figure it probably is time
> > for new main bearings, and connecting rod bearings; these I can do by
> > dropping the oil pan and replacing them myself without pulling the
> > engine.  I am hoping to be able to avoid the cam bearings because I'm
> > not equipped to pull the engine and at that point I'd probably just
> > arrange to have the engine pulled & rebuilt. Methinks that the oil
> > pressure gauge flutter of several pounds at idle and flutter on
> > acceleration is an indicator that the crankshaft is being torqued by
> > the force of the pistons / rods under firing stroke as a result of
> > excessive bearing clearance, and replacing the crank and connecting
> > rod bearings with perhaps 1 under sould address that.  FYI: the engine
> > has 99,000 miles on it, and to my knowledge has never been rebuilt.
>
> > See, my thing is this: I want to use the opportunity to do some of the
> > work myself and learn - thru - doing, but I don't want to spend the
> > next year doing this, nor do I want to have the engine totally rebuilt
> > if it doesn't absolutely need it. So I'm looking to get my
> > intellectual ducks in order and glean a little insight from you guys
> > who have been there-done that. I think Stude V8's are the perfect
> > engine to learn by doing on, since they are such friggin great engines
> > and so bulletproof.
> > -George-
> > 63 GT Hawk
> > 63 champ
> > 56 SkyHawk
>
> > On Mar 16, 3:38 pm, "studegary" wrote:
>
> >>On Mar 15, 6:22?pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
>
> >>>Hi Guys,
> >>>The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
> >>>few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
> >>>Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
> >>>barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM. ?More recently I have noted that when you
> >>>accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
> >>>when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
> >>>5 pounds. ?When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
> >>>noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
> >>>rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
> >>>further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
> >>>crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
> >>>something else. Any ideas??????????
> >>>-George-
> >>>63 GT Hawk
> >>>63 Champ
> >>>56 (very sick) Sky Hawk
>
> >>Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
> >>certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
> >>coolant.
>
> If you have a *good* oil pressure gauge, you'll notice a "little"
> flicker under acceleration, this is normal with a reasonably worn
> engine.  I think on my '62 it would noticeably drop 1-2 PSI under
> acceleration when warm; the Porsche a little more than that (but the 944
> has a known issue with rod bearings - not mine in particular, but
> apparently the crank is not drilled correctly for high RPM operation.)
>
> nate
>
> --
> replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

There is one thing that I think that I should add. I made a very BIG
mistake on my Hawk, it carried the same oil pressure as yours.

But I did not replace the rubber oil pressure line that is on the rear
of the engine. My Hawk sat is storage for almost 25 years. I got it
running with no problem and with the help of some people on here it
was a very good driver. It did not burn or leak any oil just the low
oil pressure.

I got on the freeway to go to a Studebaker meet and the old rubber
line blew and before I could stop the car the engine was toast.. $3500
Later I learned that I should have replace that line it is about a $30
part from Strude Int.

Reeplace that before you do any thing else.
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

reichsrundfunk wrote:
> Hi Guys,
> I did just notice a bit of gas leaking through the vent hole in the
> fuel pump so I do know I have to repalce that, and there is zero
> coolant in the oil - I check for that every time I pull the dipstick
> or dump out the old oil. I also change oil every 1000 miles and had
> de-sludged the engine with Mystery Oil a few months back. However, low
> pressure has always been an issue with this engine and I had been told
> by one or two people that "low oil pressure was a common situation
> with engines back then and if you don't hear anything weird, forget
> about it". I never really felt very comfortable with that theorum,
> especially after my 62 GT split a crankshaft after months of marginal
> oil pressure. The engine had been displaying a raping sound when
> fully warmed up at speeds approaching 3000 RPM on the highway, AND the
> oil pressure had been dropping on throttle ups are months now. The
> other day I finally noticed that the rapping was getting louder and
> the oil pressure at 2000 RPM was lower than it had been - and is now
> below the 1000 pound per 10,000 RPM rule. I figure it probably is time
> for new main bearings, and connecting rod bearings; these I can do by
> dropping the oil pan and replacing them myself without pulling the
> engine. I am hoping to be able to avoid the cam bearings because I'm
> not equipped to pull the engine and at that point I'd probably just
> arrange to have the engine pulled & rebuilt. Methinks that the oil
> pressure gauge flutter of several pounds at idle and flutter on
> acceleration is an indicator that the crankshaft is being torqued by
> the force of the pistons / rods under firing stroke as a result of
> excessive bearing clearance, and replacing the crank and connecting
> rod bearings with perhaps 1 under sould address that. FYI: the engine
> has 99,000 miles on it, and to my knowledge has never been rebuilt.
>
> See, my thing is this: I want to use the opportunity to do some of the
> work myself and learn - thru - doing, but I don't want to spend the
> next year doing this, nor do I want to have the engine totally rebuilt
> if it doesn't absolutely need it. So I'm looking to get my
> intellectual ducks in order and glean a little insight from you guys
> who have been there-done that. I think Stude V8's are the perfect
> engine to learn by doing on, since they are such friggin great engines
> and so bulletproof.
> -George-
> 63 GT Hawk
> 63 champ
> 56 SkyHawk
>
> On Mar 16, 3:38 pm, "studegary" wrote:
>
>>On Mar 15, 6:22?pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>Hi Guys,
>>>The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
>>>few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
>>>Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
>>>barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM. ?More recently I have noted that when you
>>>accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
>>>when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
>>>5 pounds. ?When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
>>>noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
>>>rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
>>>further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
>>>crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
>>>something else. Any ideas??????????
>>>-George-
>>>63 GT Hawk
>>>63 Champ
>>>56 (very sick) Sky Hawk
>>
>>Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
>>certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
>>coolant.
>
>
>

If you have a *good* oil pressure gauge, you'll notice a "little"
flicker under acceleration, this is normal with a reasonably worn
engine. I think on my '62 it would noticeably drop 1-2 PSI under
acceleration when warm; the Porsche a little more than that (but the 944
has a known issue with rod bearings - not mine in particular, but
apparently the crank is not drilled correctly for high RPM operation.)

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

On Mar 16, 7:37 pm, "GTHawkguy" wrote:
> On Mar 16, 3:52?pm, Nate Nagel wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > reichsrundfunk wrote:
> > > Hi Guys,
> > > I did just notice a bit of gas leaking through the vent hole in the
> > > fuel pump so I do know I have to repalce that, and there is zero
> > > coolant in the oil - I check for that every time I pull the dipstick
> > > or dump out the old oil. I also change oil every 1000 miles and had
> > > de-sludged the engine with Mystery Oil a few months back. However, low
> > > pressure has always been an issue with this engine and I had been told
> > > by one or two people that "low oil pressure was a common situation
> > > with engines back then and if you don't hear anything weird, forget
> > > about it". I never really felt very comfortable with that theorum,
> > > especially after my 62 GT split a crankshaft after months of marginal
> > > oil pressure. The engine had been displaying a raping sound when
> > > fully warmed up at speeds approaching 3000 RPM on the highway, AND the
> > > oil pressure had been dropping on throttle ups are months now. The
> > > other day I finally noticed that the rapping was getting louder and
> > > the oil pressure at 2000 RPM was lower than it had been - and is now
> > > below the 1000 pound per 10,000 RPM rule. I figure it probably is time
> > > for new main bearings, and connecting rod bearings; these I can do by
> > > dropping the oil pan and replacing them myself without pulling the
> > > engine. I am hoping to be able to avoid the cam bearings because I'm
> > > not equipped to pull the engine and at that point I'd probably just
> > > arrange to have the engine pulled & rebuilt. Methinks that the oil
> > > pressure gauge flutter of several pounds at idle and flutter on
> > > acceleration is an indicator that the crankshaft is being torqued by
> > > the force of the pistons / rods under firing stroke as a result of
> > > excessive bearing clearance, and replacing the crank and connecting
> > > rod bearings with perhaps 1 under sould address that. FYI: the engine
> > > has 99,000 miles on it, and to my knowledge has never been rebuilt.
>
> > > See, my thing is this: I want to use the opportunity to do some of the
> > > work myself and learn - thru - doing, but I don't want to spend the
> > > next year doing this, nor do I want to have the engine totally rebuilt
> > > if it doesn't absolutely need it. So I'm looking to get my
> > > intellectual ducks in order and glean a little insight from you guys
> > > who have been there-done that. I think Stude V8's are the perfect
> > > engine to learn by doing on, since they are such friggin great engines
> > > and so bulletproof.
> > > -George-
> > > 63 GT Hawk
> > > 63 champ
> > > 56 SkyHawk
>
> > > On Mar 16, 3:38 pm, "studegary" wrote:
>
> > >>On Mar 15, 6:22?pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
>
> > >>>Hi Guys,
> > >>>The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
> > >>>few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
> > >>>Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
> > >>>barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM. ?More recently I have noted that when you
> > >>>accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
> > >>>when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
> > >>>5 pounds. ?When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
> > >>>noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
> > >>>rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
> > >>>further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
> > >>>crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
> > >>>something else. Any ideas??????????
> > >>>-George-
> > >>>63 GT Hawk
> > >>>63 Champ
> > >>>56 (very sick) Sky Hawk
>
> > >>Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
> > >>certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
> > >>coolant.
>
> > If you have a *good* oil pressure gauge, you'll notice a "little"
> > flicker under acceleration, this is normal with a reasonably worn
> > engine. I think on my '62 it would noticeably drop 1-2 PSI under
> > acceleration when warm; the Porsche a little more than that (but the 944
> > has a known issue with rod bearings - not mine in particular, but
> > apparently the crank is not drilled correctly for high RPM operation.)
>
> > nate
>
> > --
> > replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.http://members.cox.net/njnagel-Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> There is one thing that I think that I should add. I made a very BIG
> mistake on my Hawk, it carried the same oil pressure as yours.
>
> But I did not replace the rubber oil pressure line that is on the rear
> of the engine. My Hawk sat is storage for almost 25 years. I got it
> running with no problem and with the help of some people on here it
> was a very good driver. It did not burn or leak any oil just the low
> oil pressure.
>
> I got on the freeway to go to a Studebaker meet and the old rubber
> line blew and before I could stop the car the engine was toast.. $3500
> Later I learned that I should have replace that line it is about a $30
> part from Strude Int.
>
> Reeplace that before you do any thing else.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

a flexible grease gun hose from wal-mart can be adapted to fit with
FLAPS fittings, don't ask me how I know, assume anal
engineering................ ,grin>
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

If you had gas in the oil, you'd have wiped all the bearing all ready and we
wouldn't be speculating on what to do. I've all ways considered the "don't
fix what ain't broke" idea to be ok, except where worn bearings and old oil
lines are concerned. If your main and rod bearings are worn to the point
that the engine is knocking, and it has developed lower oil pressure then
would be normal, then you assurdly will have worn cam bearings. If the
bottom of the engine isn't being properly lubricated, how do you suppose the
top end will be?

Of course, like my Avanti, your Hawk may be lucky. When I bought it, it had
just over 70K miles on it. It had been sitting for some time and everyone
thought the engine was stuck. Turned out to be a missing starter drive, but
the front main leaked and the upper rear pan gasket leaked. I took the
engine/tranny out and checked everything. No appricable wear noted. New
seals, gaskets to reseal engine, tranny, and rear axle. No more leaks, but
there again, no problem with oil pressure

All I'm saying is don't short cut it and whined up shooting yourself in the
foot.

Bo

"reichsrundfunk" wrote in message

> Hi Guys,
> I did just notice a bit of gas leaking through the vent hole in the
> fuel pump so I do know I have to repalce that, and there is zero
> coolant in the oil - I check for that every time I pull the dipstick
> or dump out the old oil. I also change oil every 1000 miles and had
> de-sludged the engine with Mystery Oil a few months back. However, low
> pressure has always been an issue with this engine and I had been told
> by one or two people that "low oil pressure was a common situation
> with engines back then and if you don't hear anything weird, forget
> about it". I never really felt very comfortable with that theorum,
> especially after my 62 GT split a crankshaft after months of marginal
> oil pressure. The engine had been displaying a raping sound when
> fully warmed up at speeds approaching 3000 RPM on the highway, AND the
> oil pressure had been dropping on throttle ups are months now. The
> other day I finally noticed that the rapping was getting louder and
> the oil pressure at 2000 RPM was lower than it had been - and is now
> below the 1000 pound per 10,000 RPM rule. I figure it probably is time
> for new main bearings, and connecting rod bearings; these I can do by
> dropping the oil pan and replacing them myself without pulling the
> engine. I am hoping to be able to avoid the cam bearings because I'm
> not equipped to pull the engine and at that point I'd probably just
> arrange to have the engine pulled & rebuilt. Methinks that the oil
> pressure gauge flutter of several pounds at idle and flutter on
> acceleration is an indicator that the crankshaft is being torqued by
> the force of the pistons / rods under firing stroke as a result of
> excessive bearing clearance, and replacing the crank and connecting
> rod bearings with perhaps 1 under sould address that. FYI: the engine
> has 99,000 miles on it, and to my knowledge has never been rebuilt.
>
> See, my thing is this: I want to use the opportunity to do some of the
> work myself and learn - thru - doing, but I don't want to spend the
> next year doing this, nor do I want to have the engine totally rebuilt
> if it doesn't absolutely need it. So I'm looking to get my
> intellectual ducks in order and glean a little insight from you guys
> who have been there-done that. I think Stude V8's are the perfect
> engine to learn by doing on, since they are such friggin great engines
> and so bulletproof.
> -George-
> 63 GT Hawk
> 63 champ
> 56 SkyHawk
>
> On Mar 16, 3:38 pm, "studegary" wrote:
>> On Mar 15, 6:22?pm, "reichsrundfunk" wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > Hi Guys,
>> > The 289 V8 in my 56 Sky Hawk has been getting unhappy over the past
>> > few months and I want to see what you think the root problem is.
>> > Since I've had it the oil pressure has been low when warm, delivering
>> > barely 10PSI per 1000 RPM. ?More recently I have noted that when you
>> > accelerate, the oil pressure drops - as mush as about 8 pounds, and
>> > when idling slightly warm, the oil pressure gauge flickers as much as
>> > 5 pounds. ?When cold or fully warmed up, the flicker is barely
>> > noticable if not at all. Now I am beginnning to hear the start of some
>> > rapping on slight acceleration at high speeds, so before going any
>> > further I'm trying to decide if the problem could be: a-main
>> > crankshaft bearings, or b- connecting rod bearings, or c- both, or d-
>> > something else. Any ideas??????????
>> > -George-
>> > 63 GT Hawk
>> > 63 Champ
>> > 56 (very sick) Sky Hawk
>>
>> Before digging into the engine, which you may very well have to do, be
>> certain that your oil is not being contaminated with fuel and/or
>> coolant.
>
>
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated 

I presume you are refering to the rubber hose which runs to the oil
prressure gauge?
-eorge-
 >> Stay informed about: 289 V8 Problem-Advice Appreciated